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The Range
Law & Order
Campus firearm bill sees new life, again
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<blockquote data-quote="henschman" data-source="post: 1060017" data-attributes="member: 4235"><p>The arrogance is astounding. This attitude some cops have (thinking that they are the only ones who are "professional" enough to be trusted with the responsibility of carrying a gun, or of even owning certain types of guns) is why so many gun owners have a generally negative view toward police. Its the same attitude that the British government had toward the American colonists in 1775 when the Secretary of State ordered General Gage to disarm the militias in the Massachusetts Bay Colony. </p><p></p><p>The ability to carry a weapon with you in public is part of our natural, inalienable right to self defense, which is derived from our fundamental right to live. It is outrageous to me that the state demands that I get their permission to exercise this right in the first place, and doubly outrageous that they try to bar me from doing it in a gun-free, yet lightly-protected area like a college campus.</p><p></p><p>Guys, this sounds like a situation where a little "civil disobedience" is called for: Disobeying an bad law in the name of liberty. If you were to stick a pistol in your backpack, in the little pouch on the back that you never use anyway, who would be the wiser? The only way anybody would ever find out is if you used it to try to stop a school shooting or a rape or something like that, in which case you would be a hero. You might get kicked out of the University (if you're a student), but wouldn't it be worth it? </p><p></p><p>As for the criminal penalty, it is just a misdemeanor to violate the CCW law. At most you might have to spend a night in jail before you bail out, and you'd end up paying a fine of a few hundred bucks. Actually, you'd probably get a deferred sentence, if you don't have a previous record. It CAN carry jail time, but it is rarely imposed on people who don't have records, and almost surely wouldn't be imposed by the judge if you stopped a horrible crime. This is assuming that you got convicted in the first place... if you exercised your right to a jury trial, you would have good odds of a jury "nullifying," e.g. refusing to find a guilty verdict even if the facts support it -- you are likely to get at least one person to hang the jury. The DA would be champing at the bit to get you to plea bargain for a very light penalty in a situation like that (where you're a sympathetic defendant). </p><p></p><p>When you have to make the decision whether to obey a bad law, you always have to weigh the magnitude of the possible benefits against the magnitude of the possible negative consequences of getting caught, both multiplied by the probability of them occurring. There is a very low probability of ever having to use your pistol in self defense, but if the circumstances ever arose, the benefit would be HUGE... you could save multiple lives, including your own, or stop a horrible crime like a rape. Now compare the downsides... first, there is almost no chance of getting caught if you carry on campus (as long as you're smart about it and don't go around bragging to your buddies about what you're doing), and even if you do get caught, the penalty isn't really all that bad. </p><p></p><p>I hope I'm not running afoul of any forum rules by suggesting civil disobedience. It is an American tradition, after all, going back to the Boston Tea Party and the burning of the Gaspee!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="henschman, post: 1060017, member: 4235"] The arrogance is astounding. This attitude some cops have (thinking that they are the only ones who are "professional" enough to be trusted with the responsibility of carrying a gun, or of even owning certain types of guns) is why so many gun owners have a generally negative view toward police. Its the same attitude that the British government had toward the American colonists in 1775 when the Secretary of State ordered General Gage to disarm the militias in the Massachusetts Bay Colony. The ability to carry a weapon with you in public is part of our natural, inalienable right to self defense, which is derived from our fundamental right to live. It is outrageous to me that the state demands that I get their permission to exercise this right in the first place, and doubly outrageous that they try to bar me from doing it in a gun-free, yet lightly-protected area like a college campus. Guys, this sounds like a situation where a little "civil disobedience" is called for: Disobeying an bad law in the name of liberty. If you were to stick a pistol in your backpack, in the little pouch on the back that you never use anyway, who would be the wiser? The only way anybody would ever find out is if you used it to try to stop a school shooting or a rape or something like that, in which case you would be a hero. You might get kicked out of the University (if you're a student), but wouldn't it be worth it? As for the criminal penalty, it is just a misdemeanor to violate the CCW law. At most you might have to spend a night in jail before you bail out, and you'd end up paying a fine of a few hundred bucks. Actually, you'd probably get a deferred sentence, if you don't have a previous record. It CAN carry jail time, but it is rarely imposed on people who don't have records, and almost surely wouldn't be imposed by the judge if you stopped a horrible crime. This is assuming that you got convicted in the first place... if you exercised your right to a jury trial, you would have good odds of a jury "nullifying," e.g. refusing to find a guilty verdict even if the facts support it -- you are likely to get at least one person to hang the jury. The DA would be champing at the bit to get you to plea bargain for a very light penalty in a situation like that (where you're a sympathetic defendant). When you have to make the decision whether to obey a bad law, you always have to weigh the magnitude of the possible benefits against the magnitude of the possible negative consequences of getting caught, both multiplied by the probability of them occurring. There is a very low probability of ever having to use your pistol in self defense, but if the circumstances ever arose, the benefit would be HUGE... you could save multiple lives, including your own, or stop a horrible crime like a rape. Now compare the downsides... first, there is almost no chance of getting caught if you carry on campus (as long as you're smart about it and don't go around bragging to your buddies about what you're doing), and even if you do get caught, the penalty isn't really all that bad. I hope I'm not running afoul of any forum rules by suggesting civil disobedience. It is an American tradition, after all, going back to the Boston Tea Party and the burning of the Gaspee! [/QUOTE]
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