Different references, different data?

[cdschoonie]

I’m looking through data for a Nosler .451, 250 gr HP, for my Marlin 45 Colt. In different books/sites I’m seeing much different data. For instance, the Nosler site lists W231 starting at 9.0 with 981 fps. In the Lyman book, the closest bullet which is a 250 gr. Hornady HP/XTP starting W231 at 6.5 and 824 fps. Lyman lists a Sierra 240 gr. JHC which is identical to my Nosler bullet, save 10 gr of weight.
Is the HP/XTP that much different of a bullet? Should I look at the Sierra data in Lyman? Or should I just concentrate on the Nosler site data?

 

[retrieverman]

I pretty much only use Hodgdon powder, so I only use their reloading data. It simplifies things.

 

[cdschoonie]

Another question to this, I’ve read when researching 45 Colt Handgun vs. Rifle, that anything safe in the handgun loads, the rifle can handle plus more. Is this correct?

 

[Rustygun]

I have run into the same issues with conflicting data from two sources. I have found that sometimes a small varation in the gun they used to test (some handgun rounds are tested with a 10” barrel). Sometimes the bullet type (FMJ, lead, plated) or diameter is slightly different (.355” and .356” for 9mm) which increases pressure fast. Also bullet seating depth can vary enough to increase pressures so the powder charge is less.

I usually take a middle of the road data point & shoot it over my chronograph and look for pressure signs like flat primers or cases that seem to stick in a cylinder (on 38/357) or split cases mouths. I will ramp the load up from there.

As to compatibility in rifles that I don’t know but logic says if it is safe in a pistol it should be safe in a rifle. I think one of my books shows specific rifle data, and I think the hogdens web site shows rifle data for handgun rounds.

 

[diggler1833]

Another question to this, I’ve read when researching 45 Colt Handgun vs. Rifle, that anything safe in the handgun loads, the rifle can handle plus more. Is this correct?

Typically, but not always. A lot of reloading manuals will separate 45 Colt from 45 Colt (Ruger or Freedom Arms)...or something along those lines. I would not personally recommend a hot 45 Colt round loaded for a Blackhawk be used in an old, or even clone lever action like an 1873 Winchester. But with a Marlin, I think you'll be fine.

 

[diggler1833]

I’m looking through data for a Nosler .451, 250 gr HP, for my Marlin 45 Colt. In different books/sites I’m seeing much different data. For instance, the Nosler site lists W231 starting at 9.0 with 981 fps. In the Lyman book, the closest bullet which is a 250 gr. Hornady HP/XTP starting W231 at 6.5 and 824 fps. Lyman lists a Sierra 240 gr. JHC which is identical to my Nosler bullet, save 10 gr of weight.
Is the HP/XTP that much different of a bullet? Should I look at the Sierra data in Lyman? Or should I just concentrate on the Nosler site data?

Depending on how much experience you have, it never hurts if you are a bit newer to start at the bottom of the least powerful load and work up.

Perhaps less with pistol bullets, the construction/material in rifle bullets can have a significant impact on a bullet's length. That extra .100 or .200" from an all copper bullet can get you into pressure trouble in a hurry if you just transfer data from a traditional cup and core bullet during load development and start loading near max charge weights.

If you're using a nosler bullet, I'd say that their data is usually pretty good. These days with lawyers everywhere, you'll see some pretty soft starting loads as a company can't afford to publish data that is going to blow a lot of faces off.

 

[cdschoonie]

Depending on how much experience you have, it never hurts if you are a bit newer to start at the bottom of the least powerful load and work up.

Perhaps less with pistol bullets, the construction/material in rifle bullets can have a significant impact on a bullet's length. That extra .100 or .200" from an all copper bullet can get you into pressure trouble in a hurry if you just transfer data from a traditional cup and core bullet during load development and start loading near max charge weights.

If you're using a nosler bullet, I'd say that their data is usually pretty good. These days with lawyers everywhere, you'll see some pretty soft starting loads as a company can't afford to publish data that is going to blow a lot of faces off.

Just to be on the safe side, I’m going to start at 6.5, which is what Lyman and Hodgdon suggest. It is 2.5 grains lower than the starting on Nosler’s site. I’m going to work up to 7.5, if these are good, I’ll start at 7.5 and work up watching for pressure signs.
I feel safer this way, rather than going by Nosler, since all other data at this bullet weight and powder are similar and Nosler is a big jump up from them. In the end I may end up in the 9.0-10.5 range, but at least I can sneak up on it, rather than doing a cannonball splash in the middle.

 

[diggler1833]

If you have a chronograph you can use it to see how close those starting loads get you to the velocity point you want to be at and adjust from there.

Good luck.

 

[cdschoonie]

If you have a chronograph you can use it to see how close those starting loads get you to the velocity point you want to be at and adjust from there.

Good luck.

Sadly not yet, but it’s on my Santa list!

 

[dennishoddy]

Back in the day when Ruger came out with the .44 mag semi auto rifle, manufacturers came out with loads on the shelf for .44 mag pistol, and .44 mag rifles that could take more pressure.
The public thought the rifle rounds should be fine in their S&W pistols as a +P or something resulting in several over pressure issues with pistols.
All .44 mag factory ammo is now relegated to pistol caliber pressures.
I’ve reached over 2000 FPS with the Ruger semi auto rifle with zero signs of over pressure using 240 grain bullets.
Considering the distance this rifle has been used which is under 75 yards to take deer, it’s pretty deadly.
Recently acquired a .44 mag lever gun that will need to get a load worked up for this upcoming deer season.
This rifle needs to draw blood to remain in the safe.