for hunters - 30-06 VS 308

[30BulletHoles]

Did you actually read my post? I specifically said that shooter's and equipment's ability was not in question - it's about time. Even fast magnums will take over half second to get there. Want to see what deer can pull off in 0.5 second - check out hunting section and read some bow hunting stories. At least with the bow you got a fair chance of both spooking and tracking the game; at 500 yards you don't do either - if it's not DRT ... then what?

Whats the difference in tracking a deer that didn't fall dead in its tracks at 500yds or 50 yds? Please enlighten me.

As far as flight time, guess you've never bow hunted and seen a deer "jump the string" because they hear the shot before the arrow gets to them. Depending of the speed and quietness of the bow this can occur at distances as close as 20 yards.

So don't pretend that any form of hunting is "unethical" until you've actually spent some time in the field and done it.

 

[HMFIC]

what would be the best caliber for hunting out to 500 yards???

.22 Hornet

 

[MoBoost]

Whats the difference in tracking a deer that didn't fall dead in its tracks at 500yds or 50 yds? Please enlighten me.

At 50 you can go to the shot spot and find blood trail and track - at 500 will never find that spot, so tracking is not an option.

As far as flight time, guess you've never bow hunted and seen a deer "jump the string" because they hear the shot before the arrow gets to them. Depending of the speed and quietness of the bow this can occur at distances as close as 20 yards.

I do bow hunt and had a deer jump the string; none of that affects the bullet flight and deer doing unpredictable stuff in that time.

So don't pretend that any form of hunting is "unethical" until you've actually spent some time in the field and done it.

Outside the scope of the discussion, I don't need to engage in any unethical behavior to call it such.

I do varmint long range hunt; big game I prefer to get as close as possible. Note in Oklahoma deer "hunting" season is 3.5 months long, it's the "shooting" season that is only 3 weeks.

I don't know why you are so wound up - I said I don't have a problem with long range hunting, I just don't think ethical; just like strip bars are unethical, but perfectly legal and accepted, and I don't have a problem with people going there - I just choose not to.

 

[OkieDokie1982]

That has nothing to do with what I asked.

At 50 you can go to the shot spot and find blood trail and track - at 500 will never find that spot, so tracking is not an option.


I do bow hunt and had a deer jump the string; none of that affects the bullet flight and deer doing unpredictable stuff in that time.


Outside the scope of the discussion, I don't need to engage in any unethical behavior to call it such.

I do varmint long range hunt; big game I prefer to get as close as possible. Note in Oklahoma deer "hunting" season is 3.5 months long, it's the "shooting" season that is only 3 weeks.

I don't know why you are so wound up - I said I don't have a problem with long range hunting, I just don't think ethical; just like strip bars are unethical, but perfectly legal and accepted, and I don't have a problem with people going there - I just choose not to.

 

[Grumulkin]

At 50 you can go to the shot spot and find blood trail and track - at 500 will never find that spot, so tracking is not an option.

I've shot deer at 400+ yards and found the blood trail but I guess another 100 yards and I never would have been able to.

And the "ethical" thing. Are you a vegetarian?

 

[WTJ]

At 50 you can go to the shot spot and find blood trail and track - at 500 will never find that spot, so tracking is not an option.


I do bow hunt and had a deer jump the string; none of that affects the bullet flight and deer doing unpredictable stuff in that time.


Outside the scope of the discussion, I don't need to engage in any unethical behavior to call it such.

I do varmint long range hunt; big game I prefer to get as close as possible. Note in Oklahoma deer "hunting" season is 3.5 months long, it's the "shooting" season that is only 3 weeks.

I don't know why you are so wound up - I said I don't have a problem with long range hunting, I just don't think ethical; just like strip bars are unethical, but perfectly legal and accepted, and I don't have a problem with people going there - I just choose not to.

I gotta ask: How are strip bars unethical? I probably wouldn't, under normal conditions, take a 500 yard shot with either caliber, but whose ethical standards are we using here? Are there Ethical Police?

 

[MoBoost]

If ya'll got a point to make that long range hunting is ethical - do it. By questioning my shooting and hunting skills (and now even my eating habits) you are engaging in arguing "with me", and does not contribute to the discussion.

Here is how I see it - stretching your hunting distance 3,4,5 times of the acceptable average serves only one purpose: purely egoistic bragging rights - be it to yourself, family, friends, internet. Since the decision is egoistic it is unethical by definition.

I will gladly discuss it further if we keep it civil, further personal attacks will be ignored.

Back on topic!

That has nothing to do with what I asked.

If you want 500 yard cartridge over the counter - 7mm Rem Mag will be hard to beat for availability/recoil/price/ballistics.

If you reload - I can rattle off 30 something cartridges in 6.5mm, 270, 7mm that will do superb job: my pick would be 6.5x47lap, (270)7wsm and (6.5)284win in no particular order.

 

[tsmithwick]

If ya'll got a point to make that long range hunting is ethical - do it. By questioning my shooting and hunting skills (and now even my eating habits) you are engaging in arguing "with me", and does not contribute to the discussion.

Here is how I see it - stretching your hunting distance 3,4,5 times of the acceptable average serves only one purpose: purely egoistic bragging rights - be it to yourself, family, friends, internet. Since the decision is egoistic it is unethical by definition.

How does taking a shot to test your skills in hunting make it uneathical. Its good practice for whatever events could occure in the united states and closed minedness about a particular hunting style shows that you dont understand that during most non urban combat that those ranges would be average to be shooting and you think that it is for bragging only.

 

[MoBoost]

How does taking a shot to test your skills in hunting make it uneathical.

You test your skills on practice target - treating big game animal as a practice target is unethical. Shooting a single sniper match will be better test/practice/education than a years of hunting.

Its good practice for whatever events could occure in the united states and closed minedness about a particular hunting style shows that you dont understand that during most non urban combat that those ranges would be average to be shooting and you think that it is for bragging only.

I am not closed minded at all - I clearly stated that I do it myself. BTW, in combat at these ranges shooting is done by little laser pointer - artillery and airstrikes get the job done.

 

[HMFIC]

How does taking a shot to test your skills in hunting make it uneathical. Its good practice for whatever events could occure in the united states and closed minedness about a particular hunting style shows that you dont understand that during most non urban combat that those ranges would be average to be shooting and you think that it is for bragging only.

Because hunting is not about "taking a shot to test your skills". Leaving a wounded animal in the wild to suffer and die later is not desired by anyone. The probability for doing that is much greater at 500 yards, no matter what your skill level is.

As MO described, the factors of bullet flight time, vs. animal unpredictability come into play as well as well as a host of other factors that make a 500 yard deer shot not advisable.

Consider this:

• The kill zone on a whitetail is around 15 inches square. At 500 yards, that means you must hold and shoot within around 7-1/2" from the center of that kill zone. It's not about how well you can group shots, it's about each and every shot and it's distance from center. Can you even shoot that well under ANY circumstances?
• Bullet flight time of a typical .308 or .30-06 round is around 3/4 of a second. Are you able to predict animal movement for that long.
• While considering the animal movement issue, also keep in mind your trigger control and how accurate shooting especially at that distance requires precise release and in the best cases, not knowing exactly when your shot will break.
• Are you able to determine the EXACT distance to the deer? At 500 yards on a .308, just 10% error means you will miss the deer entirely. Less than that means you potentially wound the deer. Rifle ranges are measured precisely and called "Known Distance Ranges".
• Heart rate, breathing, vision, is all affected by the adrenaline in your body when you're getting ready to kill an animal. Can you control this enough to make the shot count at 500 yards? Match shooters have a hard enough time doing it in a controlled environment.
• Did you remember to take into account the angle of elevation for the shot? At 20% you're moving the shot around 5" with .308
• How about temperature? If you sighted in during a nice blamy September aftertoon at 80 degrees and you're now shooting in 40 degrees, it does make a difference along with barometric pressure and humidity changes too.
• Wind? Can you read the wind at your location and all the possible cross wind variations between you and the target? It matters significantly at 500 and beyond.
• You won't likely be shooting a match bullet with a high BC. Although hunting bullets have made much progress in their accuracy over the years, it is still a factor in long distance accuracy that adds to the rest.
• How accurate is your rifle with a cold bore? Is that how you sighted it in? Deer don't typically stick around to let you take sighting shots.
• Parallax?
• Seriously, I could go on like this for days...

I don't want to upset the 500 yard deer hunters, but I hope those who would take this shot are realistic and honest with themselves about it. There is a difference between making a shot that you are skilled and comfortable with vs. playing pretend sniper on a deer.


To answer the OP's question specifically, either cartridge will provide practically the same results at 500 yards.