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Martini Henry
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<blockquote data-quote="Ahall" data-source="post: 4307855" data-attributes="member: 49426"><p>Before jumping into the world of Martin Henry you need to understand a few things.</p><p></p><p>1) 577/450 dates to the early days of metallic cartridges, and went through a lot of changes, including changes to the chamber dimensions. Machine work and precision measurement also were not what they are today, so adaptors are going to be hit and miss on fit. If you expect an adaptor to anything more than let the gun go bang as a novelty, you may be disappointed. </p><p></p><p>2) The English and Americans disagree on how to measure caliber - we chose the major dimension of the grooves, they like the minor dimensions of the lands (there 303 shoots a .311 projectile, but our 308 shoots a .308), </p><p>Bottom line, a 577/450 shots a projectile significantly larger than the 0.452 to 0.454 you push out of a 45-caliber pistol round. Sure, it goes bang, but engaging the rifling is going to be minimal. If you use dead soft lead it might obtrude enough to engage. </p><p></p><p>Some rifles chambered for 577/450 will engage the .458 diameter projectile used in a 45/70 (The Alexander Henry pattern Australian contract rifles made by Westley Richards are about .458, but that's because they were converted to use the 577/450). If you want it to perform, plan on a casting your own lead, learning about paper patching and all kinds of other fun stuff and you plan to roll your own for the old warhorse.</p><p></p><p>3) If you want to reload it, get ready - the 577/450 case has roughly the same head and body diameter for a 577 nitro express. Thats too big for a 7/8 - 14 thread on the reloading die. Lee made dies with the same body diameter as the threaded insert for some RCBS presses. Others have made dies in other thread sizes and pitches. Bottom line is the reloading dies don't fit in many presses.</p><p></p><p>4) Ok you read this far, so you're willing to think about reloading the old fat boy. Brass - limited commercial availability and expensive. A few folks have worked out how to reform 28 ga Magtech full brass shotgun shells into 577/450. I have seen it for sale on the British Military Forums.</p><p></p><p>5) Now you have brass - what's the load data? I have never seen anything on a smokeless load that I trusted. When I looked into it, folks load with black powder, and those who used Mag Tec cases had issues with excess case volumes. Thats right - the mag tec case has more internal capacity than the original foil cases and the general wisdom with black powder is to lightly compress the charge. No air space. </p><p> </p><p></p><p>It's a challenge to make ammo for the old warhorses to shoot, but you will probably be the only one at the range doing it.</p><p></p><p>Having done all the work to shoot one, including reforming the mag tec brass, I will say that I don't find the recoil uncomfortable, but the grip is awkward. Other designs of the era are more comfortable to hold.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ahall, post: 4307855, member: 49426"] Before jumping into the world of Martin Henry you need to understand a few things. 1) 577/450 dates to the early days of metallic cartridges, and went through a lot of changes, including changes to the chamber dimensions. Machine work and precision measurement also were not what they are today, so adaptors are going to be hit and miss on fit. If you expect an adaptor to anything more than let the gun go bang as a novelty, you may be disappointed. 2) The English and Americans disagree on how to measure caliber - we chose the major dimension of the grooves, they like the minor dimensions of the lands (there 303 shoots a .311 projectile, but our 308 shoots a .308), Bottom line, a 577/450 shots a projectile significantly larger than the 0.452 to 0.454 you push out of a 45-caliber pistol round. Sure, it goes bang, but engaging the rifling is going to be minimal. If you use dead soft lead it might obtrude enough to engage. Some rifles chambered for 577/450 will engage the .458 diameter projectile used in a 45/70 (The Alexander Henry pattern Australian contract rifles made by Westley Richards are about .458, but that's because they were converted to use the 577/450). If you want it to perform, plan on a casting your own lead, learning about paper patching and all kinds of other fun stuff and you plan to roll your own for the old warhorse. 3) If you want to reload it, get ready - the 577/450 case has roughly the same head and body diameter for a 577 nitro express. Thats too big for a 7/8 - 14 thread on the reloading die. Lee made dies with the same body diameter as the threaded insert for some RCBS presses. Others have made dies in other thread sizes and pitches. Bottom line is the reloading dies don't fit in many presses. 4) Ok you read this far, so you're willing to think about reloading the old fat boy. Brass - limited commercial availability and expensive. A few folks have worked out how to reform 28 ga Magtech full brass shotgun shells into 577/450. I have seen it for sale on the British Military Forums. 5) Now you have brass - what's the load data? I have never seen anything on a smokeless load that I trusted. When I looked into it, folks load with black powder, and those who used Mag Tec cases had issues with excess case volumes. Thats right - the mag tec case has more internal capacity than the original foil cases and the general wisdom with black powder is to lightly compress the charge. No air space. It's a challenge to make ammo for the old warhorses to shoot, but you will probably be the only one at the range doing it. Having done all the work to shoot one, including reforming the mag tec brass, I will say that I don't find the recoil uncomfortable, but the grip is awkward. Other designs of the era are more comfortable to hold. [/QUOTE]
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