Pawnee Run N Gun July 19th, 2014

[TedKennedy]

My ap said 6.48. Pecos last year said 6.32. I probably won't do pecos. It's so far away and so expensive. I think I'll do the buckholtz one again. Pecos said no supported shooting this year too I need to work on unsupported rifle shooting by far the most. I've never had any training or class or anything except for concealed carry. I ran around the woods alone with a .22 starting at like 12. Anytime I ever shoot at anything I'm leaning on a tree or something. If I'm hunting I plan that as part of my hunt or I'm behind cover. I used to sling up some as a kid just to look cool, but I never felt it made me that much more steady. Standing in the open shooting a rifle at something just isn't a normal occurrence in my world. I guess in some battle scenarios it might be.

Get thee to an Appleseed!
Seriously - We'll teach you how to use that sling on your rifle for more than a carrying strap.
I hope you change your mind about Pecos - we need all the Okies we can get down there!

 

[AllOut]

Here is a thought that I mentioned hunting...
There is a compatition called the "Train to Hunt", it's kinda like the run and gun but a lot more gay! They claim it as the "Ultimate Hunting Challenge"....
It's freaking 1.5 miles with a few obstacles and you shoot our bow at 3D targets.
We should put together an Archery run! Just like the Run N Gun!

 

[TedKennedy]

Ya damn near spot on.
I'd do the Pecos but it's during hunting season. I'll be in Kansas that week.

September? Dove hunting?

 

[AllOut]

September? Dove hunting?

Kansas bow season starts Sept 15th

 

[henschman]

I'll be in Pecos! But you knew that already. Buckholts is in the plan too.

Justin, I have used the sling hunting before... earlier this year I walked up on a hog in a field at about 120 yards. Grass was too high to get kneeling, so standing with a sling was the best I could do. Dropped her with a clean neck shot. I think you would get a lot out of an Appleseed. I was also a self-taught shooter from a young age who hadn't had any formal training, and I was amazed at how much some of the techniques taught at Appleseed improved my shooting. Just more tools for the toolbox! Plus it's cheap as training goes... only $60 for two days.

Several of us ROs got a little "Run 'n Gun style hunting" in last Friday after the RO run... I jumped out of a pickup and hauled ass across a field to shoot this guy on the run from about 75 yards:

 

[uncle money bags]

Several of us ROs got a little "Run 'n Gun style hunting" in last Friday after the RO run... I jumped out of a pickup and hauled ass across a field to shoot this guy on the run from about 75 yards:

That little excursion was a blast. We went again the next night but came up short.

 

[uncle money bags]

Pawnee Summer Run-n-Gun 2014 AAR/Lessons Learned

First things first. This has been the best overall run-n-gun so far that Al and Daniel; along with support staff, have put on yet. Everyone, to my knowledge, completed the course safely and there were zero "self selections". There were a couple of minor safety issues that were addressed immediately and without further incident. Everyones attitude was positive, despite frustration, fatigue and a wide range of abilty. It is difficult at best to take shooters ranging from virtually no experience mixed with others who have truly BTDT and still run a course of fire that is challenging to everyone without being overwhelming for some and boring for others. I think the stages and course were a good test of stamina, mental, shooting ability under the stress of time and weapon manipulation.
I would like to make a special thanks to our hosts, Jon and Susie. Their family's generosity and hard work in helping make this event something special is greatly appreciated. They really go above and beyond. I cant say enough about that.

Since the winter event I made a few changes based on what I determined were weaknesses in my training.

Starting with the physical, I started running with a pack about 5 months ago. I use the term "running" quite loosely here. Maybe "shuffling" is a better term. Using a first gen ILBE pack with between 40 and 45 pounds depending on how much water is in the bladder, I ran at least 2 miles every other day. Toward the last month I upped that to include a longer run once a week of between 3 and 5 miles. I took these short excursions exclusively in open fields, through wooded areas and along creek banks close to where I work. My unladen time per mile is just under 9 minutes, with a pack that increases to 12 or 13 minutes depending on the weather. In the winter it is faster, and it increases as the temps go up. I noticed a definite improvement in my stamina this time around. However, cramping was an issue and I suspect that my electrolyte intake was inadequate.

I changed my load out based on the increased temps as well. Gone was the PIG plate carrier and esapi plates, replaced with a chest rig and 4 double stack Eagle M4 mag pouches along with four 30 round PMags. I kept the Source 3 liter bladder and a catt TQ. Since I ran the winter event without the suppressor on my weapon and my performance was worse than with it, I added it back for this event along with a Troy stubby VFG. With the suppressor attached the mk18 weighs about 8.5 pounds unloaded. For my G17 I elected to carry 4 full mags as I planned to use the pistol exclusively at stage 2. Considering my round count, I was carrying about the right amount of pistol ammo and more than enough rifle ammo. I also elected to leave the TCI Lib II electronic muffs in the kit bag in favor of some Surefire EP3's. Well, kinda, I will explain later. A big change; for me, was footwear. I have gone through several styles of boots before finding a pair that protected my ankles, and had a similar rise as my running shoes. In the past, my boots have always caused my shins problems when running as well as hot spots or blisters. Since changing to Salomon XD 3D with copper Superfeet insoles I have had zero issues with either problem. My only gripe is that they are hot, being Goretex lined. They are a great 3 season boot though.

Equipment list:

Daniel Defense mk 18, Magpul CTR stock, VCAS sling, Aimpoint M4, YHM 5.56 can, BCM mod 1 grip, Troy stubby VFG, Knights 600m rear sight, Troy front sight, Surefire Fury light in a VTAC mount.
Glock 17 with Sevigny carry sights, Surefire X300u.
Tactical Tailor Rudder Rack, Eagle M4 mag pouches, CATT TQ in BFG holder, Source 3 liter.
HSGI suregrip belt, 2 eagle pistol mag pouches, IFAK, Tac Tailor medium pouch with necessaries, and another TQ pouch.
Ammo was hand loads. Pistol-124 gr. Rifle-77 gr.

Start-
I started the outbound road portion at a shuffle/jog. I stopped at about a mile in to stretch out my hammies and resumed. I got to the first station at about 28 or 29 minutes.

Stage 1-
Since I didn't have a wait time I took a knee and gave myself a breather for a few minutes. This procedure would be repeated at every stage I got to. Damn that vtac wall. I'm not exactly a cherry with this obstacle, but that first slot gave me what for. I don't remember my round count but I think I spent more time at the first port than I did on the others combined. # 7 was almost totally obscured by grass.
Time= 1.22 min

On the path between 1 and 2 I alternated between a jog and fast march. As the course progressed I was marching more and jogging less.

Stage 2-
After taking a knee and catching my breath I started the stage using my pistol. It was at target 3 I realized my next error. No ear pro. Inside the obstacle with nothing protecting my ears. It was painful. Almost as much as the last part of that stage when laying on the ground engaging the last two targets from behind the cardboard. I checked myself over for my ear plugs and came up short. great. In retrospect, I should have stayed with my original choice and used the rifle on this stage. It would have been faster and more quiet.
Time= 1.05 min

Off to stage 3 at mostly walking speed with a little bit of shuffling. Legs are starting to give me fits.

Stage 3-
I took a knee in the woods before the check in and dialed in my dope for the 500 yard shot. Please refer back to my previous post on the whys and whats for doing this. After getting the fire command I loaded and belly flopped down. I noticed this trend throughout the competition. The shooters who got into position the fastest were able to make the best times. Several shooters took there time getting down and made hits quickly. This would almost double or triple their final time for the stage. 1st round hit, 2nd miss, 3rd hit, 4th hit, 5th hit. My 5th round was already on its way before the sound of the 3rd hit made it back to the station.
Time= .42 min

Now the cramping started. First in the hammies, then as i bent over to stretch them my hip crease in front would cramp. Back and forth. For the rest of the course I was walking sometimes slow, sometimes fast.

Bonus stage-
Took a breather and tried to stretch some. Got my stage instructions, and grounded my rifle.
Ive dragged a rescue dummy before, but this monstrosity takes the cake for awkwardness. Tip of the hat for whoever made it. Al. Like several other shooters I flubbed the instructions up and had to send a a few more shots downrange before i finished. Mentally, I was just sub par at this stage.
Time= 1.18 min

The most memorable part of the trek back to the original property was the Bobcat on the road between the bonus stage and the county road. It just stood there in the middle of the path and stared me down until it slinked out of sight to the left. Yes I pulled my pistol, kept the muzzle down but since the path led directly up to the road I wasnt going to take a shot unless it attacked and then only into the woods away from the stage and road.

Stage4-
Stretch some more, kinda. Took a knee and my right hammy just seized up. Had to roll out of it and just truck on. Fortunately, by this time I had regained most of the hearing in my left ear so it was a pleasant surprise sending rounds into the bowling pins from under the deuce. Mentally I flubbed the course of fire again and moved off the first firing point before I had all my hits. Other than that, and shooting high from the bed of the truck before making the correction I put in a meh time.
Time= 2.27 min

More walking. Not much to add to that.

Stage 5-
Took another breather and stretched. This was becoming a pain in the rear. Got the fire command and hit the dirt. It was immediately apparent that Al and/or Daniel had decided the wire height for the previous run n guns was just too generous. This obstacle was a good 6 inches lower than before. Fun. Oh, and the ants. Thank God for the ants. I loved this stage if only for those two things. My only issue was finding the far left target. Unless you were withing heavy petting distance to the barrel you couldn't see it through the trees on the bank.
Time= 1.05 min

Actually managed a short bit a jogging to the last stage. for some reason going up hill was easier. Go figure.

Stage 6-
Got up to the top and took in the view, a few breaths and chatted with the RO. Received the stage instructions and took my position. At the fire command I got off one shot and had a mushy trigger. Performed SPORTS, because I am old school and tried to fire again. No joy. Stripped the mag from the weapon pulled the charging handle back and there it was. The second only stuck case with a ripped rim I have ever had with this gun. I cycled the action a couple of times, but that puppy wasn't coming out. As luck would have it, a cleaning rod was nearby, so I used it to clear the stoppage, reloaded and continued the stage. Unsupported firing from less than optimal positions is a skill I have not practiced enough, and it showed. I ran from position to position and was fortunate to not blank the stage.
Time= 3.47 min

As discouraging as that was, I was pretty pumped to be on the home stretch. I even managed a few jogging type steps toward the end and checked in 166 minutes after I left. Way slower than I expected myself to do.

Except for the ripped case at the end, I had no other problems with the gear selection or performance. Examining the case it was apparent it had reached the end of its service life and had probably been reloaded several times. I was somewhat satisfied with my shooting and moving on stages, but disappointed in my run time. Now, I have 6 months to address those areas before the winter event. I know I need more PT. If any one has any suggestions on the cramping or running in general I would live to hear it.

 

[uncle money bags]

Oh, and the ear pro? I found it in my cargo pocket while fishing around for my time card to turn in to the scorers at the end. Nice.

 

[cocheran]

Several of us ROs got a little "Run 'n Gun style hunting" in last Friday after the RO run... I jumped out of a pickup and hauled ass across a field to shoot this guy on the run from about 75 yards:

[/QUOTE]

Awesome!!!! I think a longer race would be cool. Where you had to take calories and water or water sterilizing stuff. Like 30 or 50 miles or something. And having a mandatory 6 hour break would cool. Where you had to camp and/or sleep. Have it all night. And have like a certain hour time limit. Like 16 or 24 hours or something so just completing in time would be a big accomplishment. I was thinking about that a few weeks ago when I ran 26.5 miles one morning. Be a nightmare to organize, but I think it could get some national recognition. Probably be the only thing like that with guns. Just thinking out loud

 

[cocheran]

Oh and I edited my video. I tried uploading a couple times yesterday. It's 1.2 GB and 20min. Pretty boring for even me to watch and I'm in it It's at 30% uploaded now. And I may have to delete it and reupload if it's in the wrong format it stretches it out on youtube. I made a couple MP4 versions yesterday and they were messed up somehow. It's one of them I uploaded and stopped yesterday.