I don't know cause I don't know. Back in my Montana days, I killed a lot of big beef steers with one 22 long rifle to the head. One of my old buddies stepped off the res for a night of fun in Harlem MT. Was screwing around drunk, town marshal shot him 3 times with a .357 magnum, he still got away. I've got 2 9mms, 2 40's, and 1 .45 commander. I like them all, but I usually carry the LC9, with the trigger that everybody says sucks, cause it fits in the back pocket of my wranglers, and the trigger doesn't bother me, I shoot it a lot. Anyway, its an interesting discussion, and I appreciate the civility of it.
Hi Chazroh, I love Cave Creek. Next to Augusta Montana, its the best place I've ever lived. That said,
one of these days I'm probably going to go back to Montana. I'm tired of working as hard as I have been, and all my grandkids are there. Years ago, I spent a month wandering around Oklahoma, doing site work for precast concrete shower and outhouse buildings, at state parks all over the state. I love your state, and the people. I heard not one cross word the whole month I was there.
one of these days I'm probably going to go back to Montana. I'm tired of working as hard as I have been, and all my grandkids are there. Years ago, I spent a month wandering around Oklahoma, doing site work for precast concrete shower and outhouse buildings, at state parks all over the state. I love your state, and the people. I heard not one cross word the whole month I was there.
Chazroh, you'll have to let me know the next time you get out this way, and we'll go out in the desert and bust a few caps.
How do you know? Have you tested all of those loads on live bodies? It may not exactly reproduce what happens in real life, but the bullets still do penetrate and some expand.
I've worked in state and federal prisons for nearly 26 years. One of the benefits is getting to look at old bullet wounds and talk to the shootees about their experiences of being shot. I've seen wounds from .45 ACP ball & HPs, 9mm ball and various HPs, .357 Sig HPs, .38 Spl. round nose lead and HPs, 7.62 x 39, .22 lr, 12 gauge #4 buckshot, 12 gauge 00 buckshot, and a wound caused by the mighty 12 gauge slug which embedded itself in the shootee's pelvis at cross-room distance.
It's hard to get specifics from inmates on the type of loads they were shot with because they generally aren't that educated about guns. They do always know the caliber and many know whether is was ball or HPs. of course of it was the cops doing the shooting you can count on the ammo being HPs.
One clown I know was shot three times with a .357 Sig while trying to escape from US Marshal custody in OKC. He was running fast but stopped after the third hit and told the marshal to please stop shooting him because "I quit!" He told me it hurt. That's his story anyway. And he's alive & well, and only has a little limp.
The clown who took the 12 gauge slug in the pelvis has a bigger limp and claims that there is still lead stuck in the bone.
Another clown I know was shot five times with .45 ACP ball, four were solid torso hits and one was through the bicep. The only round that exited was the one through the bicep. He took bullets in both lungs and one kidney. He lost that kidney. He drove himself to the nearest ER before collapsing from blood loss.
Another one I know was shot by county deputies and US Marshals. He took a .38 spl HP through an arm and one single .33 cal 00 buck pellet from a 12 gauge in the intestines. He said he hardly noticed the .38 wound, but that one tiny lead ball in his guts took all of the fight out of him. He said the pain was excruciating and that wound continues to cause him health problems nearly 40 years later.
One thing I'm convinced of is that I don't want to be shot, but even so guns are not death rays. The one-shot-stop is pretty rare, and being shot can kill you years later and cause serious health problems if it doesn't.
It's hard to get specifics from inmates on the type of loads they were shot with because they generally aren't that educated about guns. They do always know the caliber and many know whether is was ball or HPs. of course of it was the cops doing the shooting you can count on the ammo being HPs.
One clown I know was shot three times with a .357 Sig while trying to escape from US Marshal custody in OKC. He was running fast but stopped after the third hit and told the marshal to please stop shooting him because "I quit!" He told me it hurt. That's his story anyway. And he's alive & well, and only has a little limp.
The clown who took the 12 gauge slug in the pelvis has a bigger limp and claims that there is still lead stuck in the bone.
Another clown I know was shot five times with .45 ACP ball, four were solid torso hits and one was through the bicep. The only round that exited was the one through the bicep. He took bullets in both lungs and one kidney. He lost that kidney. He drove himself to the nearest ER before collapsing from blood loss.
Another one I know was shot by county deputies and US Marshals. He took a .38 spl HP through an arm and one single .33 cal 00 buck pellet from a 12 gauge in the intestines. He said he hardly noticed the .38 wound, but that one tiny lead ball in his guts took all of the fight out of him. He said the pain was excruciating and that wound continues to cause him health problems nearly 40 years later.
One thing I'm convinced of is that I don't want to be shot, but even so guns are not death rays. The one-shot-stop is pretty rare, and being shot can kill you years later and cause serious health problems if it doesn't.
