SDA and Mental Health

[OkieGunLover]

In March 2016, I went to see a local doctor about some anxiety issues and was prescribed Paroxetine for about 6 months. During that time, I attended sessions with a therapist 2 times a month at the recommendation of my doctor. After all was said and done, I was feeling much better. Now that 2017 rolled around, I completed a conceal carry course but am completely unsure if I am able to get one due to going to the doctor and the therapist. Will these factors deny me a license?

 

[FrankNmac]

Here is a copy of what the Oklahoma SDA book

https://www.ok.gov/osbi/documents/SDA_LAW_BOOK.pdf

says:

TITLE 21 § 1290.10 MANDATORY PRECLUSIONS In addition to the requirements stated in Section 1290.9 of this title, the conditions stated in this section shall preclude a person from eligibility for a handgun license pursuant to the provisions of the Oklahoma Self-Defense Act. The occurrence of any one of the following conditions shall deny the person the right to have a handgun license pursuant to the provisions of the Oklahoma Self- Defense Act. Prohibited conditions are:
7. "Currently undergoing treatment for a mental illness, condition, or disorder. For purposes of this paragraph, "currently undergoing treatment for a mental illness, condition, or disorder" means the person has been diagnosed by a licensed physician as being afflicted with a substantial disorder of thought, mood, perception, 5 psychological orientation, or memory that significantly impairs judgment, behavior, capacity to recognize reality, or ability to meet the ordinary demands of life;

I don't know the interpretation, but here is the answer from the Oklahoma SDA Q&A site:

https://www.ok.gov/osbi/Handgun_Licensing/SDA_FAQs.html#Q16

"16. What if I’ve had mental health treatment?

You are not eligible for an SDA license if you are currently undergoing or in the last 3 years undergone treatment for a mental illness, condition, or disorder. For purposes of this paragraph, "currently undergoing treatment for a mental illness, condition, or disorder" means the person has been diagnosed by a licensed physician as being afflicted with a substantial disorder of thought, mood, perception, psychological orientation, or memory that significantly impairs judgment, behavior, capacity to recognize reality, or ability to meet the ordinary demands of life. The preclusive period is 3 years from the last date of treatment or until you can present a certified statement from a licensed physician stating that you are either no longer disabled by any mental or psychiatric illness, condition, or disorder or that you have been stabilized on medication for ten (10) years or more.

You will also be denied for attempted suicide or other condition relating to or indicating mental instability or an unsound mind which occurred within the preceding ten-year period.

Involuntary commitment for a mental illness, condition, or disorder and adjudication as an incompetent person are permanent preclusions as well."

Here is my editorializing ;-) Having read that, it seems to be such a broad brush paint by the Q&A that it feels like those who would take our Constitution and interpret it to mean more than what the words themselves do. Using their Q&A interpretation of the SDA book, anyone who goes to the doctor and gets any drug for a "mental illness" (as defined by the Mayo Clinic Staff below) could could include depression, anxiety, gambling and sex addiction, overeating or undereating, sadness over the loss of a loved one, etc.

I can't believe that is the intent of the SDA law and think it unreasonable and overreach to have that Q&A interpretation serving as the restrictive clause it would appear to embrace.

Definition
By Mayo Clinic Staff

Mental illness refers to a wide range of mental health conditions — disorders that affect your mood, thinking and behavior. Examples of mental illness include depression, anxiety disorders, schizophrenia, eating disorders and addictive behaviors.

 

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

I don't know the interpretation, but here is the answer from the Oklahoma SDA site:

https://www.ok.gov/osbi/Handgun_Licensing/SDA_FAQs.html#Q16

16. What if I’ve had mental health treatment?

You are not eligible for an SDA license if you are currently undergoing or in the last 3 years undergone treatment for a mental illness, condition, or disorder.For purposes of this paragraph, "currently undergoing treatment for a mental illness, condition, or disorder" means the person has been diagnosed by a licensed physician as being afflicted with a substantial disorder of thought, mood, perception, psychological orientation, or memory that significantly impairs judgment, behavior, capacity to recognize reality, or ability to meet the ordinary demands of life. The preclusive period is 3 years from the last date of treatment or until you can present a certified statement from a licensed physician stating that you are either no longer disabled by any mental or psychiatric illness, condition, or disorder or that you have been stabilized on medication for ten (10) years or more.

You will also be denied for attempted suicide or other condition relating to or indicating mental instability or an unsound mind which occurred within the preceding ten-year period.

Involuntary commitment for a mental illness, condition, or disorder and adjudication as an incompetent person are permanent preclusions as well.

Unless one of these bolded terms applied to you at the time, you should be fine. Look to the underlined portions to see just how significant the illness needs to be to fit the list of prohibitions. In short, if you were capable of leading a normal life (going to work, cleaning the house, cooking, driving a car, etc...) you weren't "sick" enough.

Plus, I can pretty much guaran-damn-tee you your physician didn't call OSBI and tell them you had lost your marbles. They are unwilling to say anything for fear of violating HIPPA. It would almost require a court to have adjudicated you incompetent to fit these prohibitions.

A generalized anxiety issue is not the type of problem the rule contemplates.

 

[D. Hargrove]

I am NOT a lawyer, I think you are fine IMO. Like @FrankNmac posted "substantial disorder".

 

[FrankNmac]

After posting and reading the Q&A response on the SDA website, it seems as if that is not only an overreach but also an arbitrary opinion someone came up with that goes far beyond any intention of the actual SDA specific language.

I wonder how that issue could be raised and addressed at the state level?

 

[SMS]

Just preempt it. Avoid the speculation and worry by getting the aforementioned letter from your doctor stating you are no longer disabled by any mental or psychiatric illness or condition.

Check the right box on the application and include the letter.

 

[Frederick]

There's no way the government can gain access to those records, and the resources available to the state make it incredibly unlikely that they will ever be able to discover your situation. the only way they would know about it is if you told them.

I would advise doing what @SMS said.

 

[Profreedomokie]

As an instructor my opinion ,based on past research ,is you should not have a problem. I've attended workshops put on by the state and they covered this issue. At the time their logic was that if a woman took a mild sedative for mood swings it wasn't an issue. ( just the example they used ) But if a person took something really heavy like Prozac ,they couldn't get a carry permit. I know anxiety is considered mental illness but, I don't think it is considered a " substantial disorder ". The only issue would be how heavy a drug the Paroxetine is. I know cops fall under different rules but, I know there are cops out there on Prozac and some that have had anxiety issues.

 

[steelfingers]

Prior to getting my CC, I called someone I knew and was directed to the states council that deals with the gun laws.
When asking questions about the entire exclusions section, this part came up and I asked what it meant. She said it's one of the worst written legal documents ever.
She sort of laughed and said "It means whatever it says and it says nothing"
I think she was being funny but honest at the same time.
It's very loose. Problem comes, if you interpret the law incorrect, you have lied on a legal document and are done. Ignorance of the law is no excuse even when the authors are ignorant of the law they inked.
Good luck

 

[Rod Snell]

Just preempt it. Avoid the speculation and worry by getting the aforementioned letter from your doctor stating you are no longer disabled by any mental or psychiatric illness or condition.

Check the right box on the application and include the letter.

I am curious if you or anyone else here knows of an MD in the state of Oklahoma who has provided such a letter for any SDA applicant. In preparing to be an SDA instructor over 10 years ago, the confidential opinion I got from some MD friends was they would not for anyone.