Army wants to dump the M9?

[uncle money bags]

sounds like that cop needs some training to me.

"You have to shoot people a lot with a handgun."

Yeah, that happens when you shoot them in the wrong place.

 

[dennishoddy]

With the FMJ ball ammo, you need the biggest hole you can get.

 

[uncle money bags]

I would partially agree with you Dennis. However, hole size is less important than its location.

 

[ASP785]

sounds like that cop needs some training to me.



Yeah, that happens when you shoot them in the wrong place.

Hopefully if I have some meth-head charging and shooting at me I can exercise all of the fundamentals of shooting properly and place two rounds in his head...because even the pro's never miss.

 

[uncle money bags]

Its still the truth ASP. Shot placement is king. Everyone who carries a gun for protection should train under stress and with competent instruction to the highest level they can. You owe that much to yourself and the people you intend to protect.
This doesnt mean you will be successful every time, but you will be more prepared for the moment when it arises. Brain box shots are an ideal, but high thoracic shots centered on the spine are easier, if not just as effective. as long as the round has the penetration needed.

Anyway, i hope you are able to make a fight ending shot under those circumstances as well.

 

[dennishoddy]

I would partially agree with you Dennis. However, hole size is less important than its location.

Absolutly!

 

[ASP785]

UMB, you are a knowledgeable guy whose opinion I respect, but handgun cartridges just aren't effective man stoppers. I don't think you are really disagreeing with that statement insomuch as you are saying that you need to be most concerned with shot placement. That's sound advice. Sgt. Gramins shot that suspect 14 times, heart, both lungs, liver, diaphragm and kidney, he didn't go down until he was shot in the head! That's just crazy.

 

[rlongnt]

The reason the Marines went with the 1911 was it is already in the supply line, same with bringing back/dusting off the the M14. Not switching to something like the HK 45/FN/Glock/whatever kept things simple. For recent new builds Colt was already a supplier, SA and Kimber made a few too so that kept politicians out of military business "for now". I won’t argue the merits of either caliber but .mil is going to be using FMJ so the argument for JHP all being equal does not apply. The NATO 9mm is hotter than off the shelf WWB too though.

I know just how awesome the accuracy can be for a 1911 but in the hands of normal guys I wonder how far the qualification scores would drop if it was generally issued again. I’m guessing quite a bit. Placement is critical so that needs to be factored heavily into the equation. This isn't a trip to Wal-Mart in a CCW rig so capacity is another major issue.

I think they should have just gone with the Sig P226 and called it a day. I was lucky enough to get my brand spanking new issued M9 in 1989 so I thought it was great, I never had to use it for real though thank God.

Glad I could clarify up absolutely nothing here… : )

To be honest, I'm really a little pissed off that it's 2014 and I still don't have some sort of phaser blaster or jet pack. Come on DARPA quit holding back on us.

 

[Shadowrider]

I suspect that it will be a Sig, HK, or FN in .45. But I'd love to see them go with the M&P45. American gun that can meet their goofy external safety requirement and they would be well armed. The cost would be very reasonable without giving anything up really.

 

[Hoov]

Great post, riongnt.