Oklahoma House democrats introduce SAVE Act to curb gun violence

[DavidMcmillan]

Something to ponder… we talk a lot about how the laws that have been passed have not done anything to stop the criminal element or other forms of shootings. Could part of the ineffectiveness of those laws be due to our efforts and those of the lobbyists we have supported, resulting in laws so watered down that they had little, if any, effect?

I’m not saying our efforts were misplaced, but maybe we shouldn’t be constantly talking about how ineffective current laws are.

We really need to be improving our defense tactics.

 

[Tanis143]

It makes little sense to talk to Trump snowflakes. If you could talk sense to them, then they wouldn't be Trump snowflakes. Sorry you got so triggered.

Then don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya. Go live in California, they have all the gun control you want and look what a lovely place its become. If you think wanting freedom with less ATF making rules up as they go, mystical round limits being senseless and that Joe Biden is the worst president we have had since FDR is being a snowflake, then a snowflake I am. But since the liberal left is all about more power to the government and making laws that punish regular people, I say screw the democrat party, FJB and lets go Brandon.

And your party is in for a world of hurt this midterms. Then maybe we can get the GCA and NFA repealed (hey, I can hope. Boebert would probably submit it).

 

[Tanis143]

Something to ponder… we talk a lot about how the laws that have been passed have not done anything to stop the criminal element or other forms of shootings. Could part of the ineffectiveness of those laws be due to our efforts and those of the lobbyists we have supported, resulting in laws so watered down that they had little, if any, effect?

I’m not saying our efforts were misplaced, but maybe we shouldn’t be constantly talking about how ineffective current laws are.

We really need to be improving our defense tactics.

Which laws are you referring to? And explain how any of the laws would stop someone who has no criminal history, no mental health history from purchasing a firearm and causing a mass shooting? The last two we had the POS's bought their firearms legally.

The biggest problem is that people don't want to look at the root cause of all these shootings. For one, as a country, we have cut almost all mental health funding and reduced places that people with mental health can get the help they need. Several of the mass shooters in the last decade have shown signs of mental health issues but nowhere for them to seek help. Most firearm violence is due to gang and criminal activity in impoverished communities, so that is a social-economical issue. If these politicians spent half as much time advocating for solutions to those problems we could wipe out most of the firearm violence that is out there.

Its just like with school shootings. Instead of banning firearms and turning current law-abiding citizens into criminals overnight, we should be looking at ways to secure schools instead.

But that is not what these gun grabbers want. They want an excuse to start the path of total firearm ban like they have in other countries. They have main stream politicians now calling for a total repeal of the 2nd amendment, something that would not have even dared been mention just a few years ago.

 

[silvius]

Then don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya. Go live in California, they have all the gun control you want and look what a lovely place its become. If you think wanting freedom with less ATF making rules up as they go, mystical round limits being senseless and that Joe Biden is the worst president we have had since FDR is being a snowflake, then a snowflake I am. But since the liberal left is all about more power to the government and making laws that punish regular people, I say screw the democrat party, FJB and lets go Brandon.

And your party is in for a world of hurt this midterms. Then maybe we can get the GCA and NFA repealed (hey, I can hope. Boebert would probably submit it).

Sorry this got you so triggered. I know it is frustrating that the twice impeached one term loser got booted.

 

[DavidMcmillan]

Which laws are you referring to? And explain how any of the laws would stop someone who has no criminal history, no mental health history from purchasing a firearm and causing a mass shooting? The last two we had the POS's bought their firearms legally.

The biggest problem is that people don't want to look at the root cause of all these shootings. For one, as a country, we have cut almost all mental health funding and reduced places that people with mental health can get the help they need. Several of the mass shooters in the last decade have shown signs of mental health issues but nowhere for them to seek help. Most firearm violence is due to gang and criminal activity in impoverished communities, so that is a social-economical issue. If these politicians spent half as much time advocating for solutions to those problems we could wipe out most of the firearm violence that is out there.

Its just like with school shootings. Instead of banning firearms and turning current law-abiding citizens into criminals overnight, we should be looking at ways to secure schools instead.

But that is not what these gun grabbers want. They want an excuse to start the path of total firearm ban like they have in other countries. They have main stream politicians now calling for a total repeal of the 2nd amendment, something that would not have even dared been mention just a few years ago.

I failed to explain what I was thinking. We continue to point to “20,000 laws” that are not being enforced. I don’t know if 20,000 is a correct amount, but that doesn’t matter.

What I was referring to was maybe we were successful in keeping laws from being written that would have been effective in reducing some of these incidents, but would have been unconstitutional, at least in our eyes.

I consider that as success for our side, however, by pointing out the inadequacy of current law, we may be encouraging ore restrictive laws to be written.

We may have been successful up to this point, but I’m not convinced that we can continue to use the same approach in the future.

We are losing in the court of public opinion. It is easy to see how how “non-gun” people are beginning to say “enough is enough” and increase their call for action.

I don’t have any answers, only questions.

 

[LBnM]

It's not just the "non-gun" people saying "enough is enough." It's many gun owners as well. There is no real reason an 18yr old nutcase constitutional right is more important than one child's life.

 

[DavidMcmillan]

I don't think anyone disagrees with that, but the question of who decides the 18 year old is a "nut case", and how is that decision made and carried out, is the question.

 

[dlbleak]

I was having a phone conversation with another member the other day. He had a suggestion that I could possibly get on board with. When a person turns 18 or 21 and is buying their first gun, have the ability to look at their sealed juvenile records.

 

[Tanis143]

It's not just the "non-gun" people saying "enough is enough." It's many gun owners as well. There is no real reason an 18yr old nutcase constitutional right is more important than one child's life.

Nice gaslighting there fella. So does that mean us sane adults need to be restricted because someone used <insert type of gun here> illegally? OR should we increase security measures at school, allow those teachers who want to train and carry a firearm to do so, and increase spending on mental health? That is the problem. A person uses a firearm to commit murder and somehow its the gun's fault and all of us must now give up that gun. If we allow them to follow that path we will be stripped of our right to keep and bare arms as the laws won't stop the shootings.

Gun owners have allowed some much infraction on the 2nd amendment and the gun grabbers constantly want more.

As for any gun owner who supports ANY of this legislation, they are blind to where that road leads. If allowed, they will be lead straight to a land where they will be serfs instead of citizens.

 

[Glocktogo]

It's not just the "non-gun" people saying "enough is enough." It's many gun owners as well. There is no real reason an 18yr old nutcase constitutional right is more important than one child's life.

I agree. I just completely disagree that we lawful gun owners need to turn over our constitutional rights FIRST. How about we make that the very LAST resort?

Every one of these nutbags was “on the radar” of some government agency. Whether it be a school, town, county, state or federal. We always find out that someone knew and if they didn’t do nothing, they damned sure didn’t do enough!

Contrary to what the media and Democrats are trying to fool is intl believing, there are already laws on the books to deal with this. The FBI can literally round up every last person who was present at the Capitol, but they can’t stop known threats to children (and yes I’m including Epstein and Nasser with the school shooters). Why is that?

But OK, let’s pretend that all the authority figures AREN’T cowering behind their badges, titles and desks (news flash, they are) every time the **** hits the fan. So let’s pretend that it’s the “easy access to guns by 18-21 year olds?

Fine, but lets stop being hypocrites about it. If they can’t be trusted with their constitutional rights, then they can’t be trusted with responsibilities either. So make it 21 if you will, but make it 21 for EVERYTHING. Voting, driving, the draft, volunteering for military service, legally binding contracts, the works.

You don’t get to pick and choose what to give and what to take away, and then take away the one that just happens to be a constitutional right. And if you’re gonna do exactly that, I’d prefer you to pre-qualify your nonsensical statement with “Now I know I’m a hypocrite, but hear me out…

The nutbags on this forum calling for restrictions on our 2nd Amendment rights remind me of every appeasement peddler in history, losers. Well do us all a favor and go lose somewhere else. We don’t need you. I’m not giving up on 18-21 gun owners just because I’m older than 21. Doing that would be hypocritical to the guy who bought a Mini-14 when he was 19 and serving in the Marines back in 1984.