OK ID no longer suitable for getting on planes or into federal buildings...

[Glocktogo]

I agree that your assessment is likely correct. I was merely seeking clarification as to why this was a 'state's rights' issue in the way the OP implied. The requirements to fly have never been left to each state as far as i know, so why would this issue be any different. Yes, the feds are leveraging States to comply, (which i do disagree with) but they've done it for lots of other issues in the past (such as the drinking age and federal highway funds). The ruling wouldn't invalidate Oklahoma's ID, but would say that it doesn't meet the criteria to enter federally controlled areas.

If we're going to get worked up about something, lets at least get worked up about the correct thing.

Keep in mind that these areas (the Sterile Area of an airport) are federally regulated, not federally controlled. It's a complex issue with TSA being the arbiter of granting or denying access in most airports, but the distinction is important. A U.S. courthouse would be a federally controlled area, as well as an FAA ATC tower.

The other fights have been over funding, not access or travel. This is a fight over the right to travel peaceably for U.S. citizens and the right of states to have control over their ID system.

If this is like any other fed initiative, I'd imagine they have attached significant strings to the funding of compliance with RealID. Access to the database probably being one of them. THAT, would undermine state sovereignty.

I know my agency was willing to pay for a security system for the regulated entity where I work. The "carrot" required unrestricted access to said system. The offer was rebuffed, resoundingly.

What would you do?

 

[TerryMiller]

It already won't get you on a military base, regardless of the state of issue. Civilian employees and military members all carry what's called a Common Access Card (CAC) that is the ID and access card for the military's computer systems. I bet it's the same for most federal employees who work off base in a semi-secure location. Basically, civilian employees who work on base already have a federal ID with a ton of their info stored on the encrypted chip within the card.

OK. I'm not sure on that in bold above. Back on May 3rd, the wife, my youngest son and myself went to the Fort Sill Artillery Museum. We presented our OK driver's licenses and had no problem with getting on the base.

Also, as of January 2014, 21 states are compliant with the Real ID Act, 20 states and territories have been granted renewable extensions (until October 10, 2014), and 15 states and territories are noncompliant (but are eligible for extensions).

Over in the RV'ing world, it has been stated that in South Dakota (a state popular for RV'ers to establish residency for various reasons) when one wants to establish residency there, the women have to provide both marriage certificates and divorce decrees (if any apply) to establish their "legal" name for their driver's licenses. Supposedly, this was required to meet the Real ID Act requirements However, we just got our Colorado driver's licenses, which have a gold star in the upper right hand corner to signify some level of compliance, and the wife did not have to supply all that documentation. All she had to do was present her OK driver's license (later voided) and answer a few questions.

 

[SoonerP226]

They will either work out a compromise or they'll extend the deadline for compliance, indefinitely if necessary.

The compromise for air travel, I'm told, is to bring your passport.

I don't fly, so I don't particularly follow the subject, but the person who told me that is an actual attorney, so...

 

[donner]

Keep in mind that these areas (the Sterile Area of an airport) are federally regulated, not federally controlled. It's a complex issue with TSA being the arbiter of granting or denying access in most airports, but the distinction is important. A U.S. courthouse would be a federally controlled area, as well as an FAA ATC tower.

The other fights have been over funding, not access or travel. This is a fight over the right to travel peaceably for U.S. citizens and the right of states to have control over their ID system.

If this is like any other fed initiative, I'd imagine they have attached significant strings to the funding of compliance with RealID. Access to the database probably being one of them. THAT, would undermine state sovereignty.

I know my agency was willing to pay for a security system for the regulated entity where I work. The "carrot" required unrestricted access to said system. The offer was rebuffed, resoundingly.

What would you do?

I'm not advocating one way or another. I think it's an important issue, but again, i want to get at the actual issue (and not get bogged down in the state's rights stuff). I don't like the idea of a national registry either, but the feds saying what type of ID is required for accessing federally regulated areas isn't the right fight to have.

Access to air travel has always been a federally regulated issue and not something that the states have dealt with. Also, this isn't a ban on people from one state flying, it merely says which forms of ID are permissible to gain access to federally regulated areas. We could get into the whole 'is air travel a right or privilege' issue but you and have both seen how that goes on OSA. I'm just pointing out that there is nothing here that bars anyone from doing anything, but just changes the required documentation needed (and yes, it does make the process slightly more onerous).

 

[Glocktogo]

I'm not advocating one way or another. I think it's an important issue, but again, i want to get at the actual issue (and not get bogged down in the state's rights stuff). I don't like the idea of a national registry either, but the feds saying what type of ID is required for accessing federally regulated areas isn't the right fight to have.

Access to air travel has always been a federally regulated issue and not something that the states have dealt with. Also, this isn't a ban on people from one state flying, it merely says which forms of ID are permissible to gain access to federally regulated areas. We could get into the whole 'is air travel a right or privilege' issue but you and have both seen how that goes on OSA. I'm just pointing out that there is nothing here that bars anyone from doing anything, but just changes the required documentation needed (and yes, it does make the process slightly more onerous).

But it is very much a states rights issue. The feds are telling the state what to do to comply with a federal problem. They are only willing to pay for it if they get to have access to it, which interferes with state sovereignty.

The correct answer is to issue a federal ID FOR FREE, to any U.S. citizen that wishes to have one. After all, do we not issue Social Security ID numbers for free? The precedent is already set. After all, just like SS tax this ID would facilitate the collection of federal taxes on airline tickets (Called a Passenger Security Fee).

So the feds should decide whether it's more important to make a political statement, or increase security. It's their choice.

 

[KOPBET]

Thank you Republicans...

(yes, I am one)

 

[farmerbyron]

Article IV, Section 1:

Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state. And the Congress may by general laws prescribe the manner in which such acts, records, and proceedings shall be proved, and the effect thereof.

 

[Glocktogo]

Article IV, Section 1:

Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state. And the Congress may by general laws prescribe the manner in which such acts, records, and proceedings shall be proved, and the effect thereof.

Your point?

 

[travisstorma]

OK. I'm not sure on that in bold above. Back on May 3rd, the wife, my youngest son and myself went to the Fort Sill Artillery Museum. We presented our OK driver's licenses and had no problem with getting on the base.

Also, as of January 2014, 21 states are compliant with the Real ID Act, 20 states and territories have been granted renewable extensions (until October 10, 2014), and 15 states and territories are noncompliant (but are eligible for extensions).

Over in the RV'ing world, it has been stated that in South Dakota (a state popular for RV'ers to establish residency for various reasons) when one wants to establish residency there, the women have to provide both marriage certificates and divorce decrees (if any apply) to establish their "legal" name for their driver's licenses. Supposedly, this was required to meet the Real ID Act requirements However, we just got our Colorado driver's licenses, which have a gold star in the upper right hand corner to signify some level of compliance, and the wife did not have to supply all that documentation. All she had to do was present her OK driver's license (later voided) and answer a few questions.

I do field service that has equipment in Fort Sill, Mcconnell and Vance AFB. Fort Sill I just show my DL and they let me on. McConnell and Vance I have to have a sponsor that escorts me everywhere.

 

[kennedy]

This brought this scene from "The Hunt for Red October" to mind...

Capt. Vasili Borodin: I will live in Montana. And I will marry a round American woman and raise rabbits, and she will cook them for me. And I will have a pickup truck... maybe even a "recreational vehicle." And drive from state to state. Do they let you do that?
Captain Ramius: I suppose.
Capt. Vasili Borodin: No papers?
Captain Ramius: No papers, state to state.