I get it...but I am in the minority here having to fight this battle...I have tried other means such as appealing to people's sense of liberty despite their personal feelings about vaccines; it hasn't worked much. This issue is just to divisive glocker. I was attempting to show their logic using environmental issues.
Okay, I'll give it you you...that was funny
I thought about this issue some more fellas...it is gridlock...you guys are set in stone because you think you need to protect your kids...we on the other side have the same feelings...the difference is, in order to (in your view) protect your kids, you have to offensively move to take my rights and potentially even hurt my kids. So basically, you are desperate enough to do this even though there is no real problem in our state. My side just wants to be left alone and get the same rights as tax payers as everyone else. My side has the moral high-ground because we are not the ones on offense. You will fail. And if you succeed you will have done more to advance the anti-constitutional agenda then the gun grabbers ever have...think it over, regardless of your personal opinion on vaccines. This is a liberty issue and with 99% vaccination rates, you just don't have the mass polio deaths you come close to justifying forcing my kids to get the rotavirus vaccine...that is another one of your weaknesses...the "all or nothing" approach. If you wanted a better chance, then you would only seek to mandate those vaccines that can be justified more than others (such as whooping cough). Even then, you'd face resistance and the religious freedom argument. But you'd look more genuine and intelligent to acknowledge that not all vaccines on the schedule are of equal benefit vs risk.
Let's evaluate your argument using a different situation:
Multiple sources are reporting that a sizable enemy force is posed to invade the country. Military leaders call for a draft to strengthen the defense of the country...
"My side just wants to be left alone and get the same rights as tax payers as everyone else. My side has the moral high-ground because we are not the ones (putting our kids at risk) on offense. You will fail. And if you succeed (in drafting our kids) you will have done more to advance the (possibility of war) anti-constitutional agenda then the gun grabbers ever have...think it over, regardless of your personal opinion on (the threat to our country) vaccines. This is a liberty issue and with (unreliable military intelligence) 99% vaccination rates, you just don't have (hard evidence that about the size of the enemy force or their intent) the mass polio deaths you come close to justifying forcing my kids (to be drafted) to get the rotavirus vaccine...that is another one of your weaknesses...the "all or nothing" approach (Let's hold off and see what happens before acting rashly by drafting everyone). If you wanted a better chance, then you would (allow people to volunteer to serve in the military and not force them) only seek to mandate those vaccines that can be justified more than others (such as whooping cough)."
Emotions are the primary driver behind your anti-vaccine arguments, not facts. One can always find scary articles and pseudo-science to push out in front but the real foundation of the anti-vaccine position is irrational fear.
I believe it is wrong to force inoculations but also wrong to withhold inoculations from your children, thereby endangering them and large numbers of people by increasing the chance of serious epidemics.
Multiple sources are reporting that a sizable enemy force is posed to invade the country. Military leaders call for a draft to strengthen the defense of the country...
"My side just wants to be left alone and get the same rights as tax payers as everyone else. My side has the moral high-ground because we are not the ones (putting our kids at risk) on offense. You will fail. And if you succeed (in drafting our kids) you will have done more to advance the (possibility of war) anti-constitutional agenda then the gun grabbers ever have...think it over, regardless of your personal opinion on (the threat to our country) vaccines. This is a liberty issue and with (unreliable military intelligence) 99% vaccination rates, you just don't have (hard evidence that about the size of the enemy force or their intent) the mass polio deaths you come close to justifying forcing my kids (to be drafted) to get the rotavirus vaccine...that is another one of your weaknesses...the "all or nothing" approach (Let's hold off and see what happens before acting rashly by drafting everyone). If you wanted a better chance, then you would (allow people to volunteer to serve in the military and not force them) only seek to mandate those vaccines that can be justified more than others (such as whooping cough)."
Emotions are the primary driver behind your anti-vaccine arguments, not facts. One can always find scary articles and pseudo-science to push out in front but the real foundation of the anti-vaccine position is irrational fear.
I believe it is wrong to force inoculations but also wrong to withhold inoculations from your children, thereby endangering them and large numbers of people by increasing the chance of serious epidemics.
Well said.
As you can see from your efforts here, justifying bad or ignorant behavior with bad or ignorant behavior is not a good way to make a point.
No, you do not get it. You are not even in the zip code for getting it.
The issue is that if your little mouth breather coughs up a fur ball on a person who has an immune deficiency that person can die because you didn’t vaccinate your child. Another child gets sick because he or she had a parent of like mind as you and didn’t vaccinate their child AND your child gets sick. And all you can say is that is what people who support “freedom” and “liberty” should do?!?
When people like you think as you do that is when problems arise. And NO, the “guberment” should not be telling us what to do BUT you should have the ******* common sense to do the right thing before they have to tell you or you have to play your Darwin Card.
That is the most patently ignorant comment to date. Take the tinfoil hat off and look at the data. If you buy into the abject fear tactic ******** that vaccines are a bigger risk than not being vaccinated then I would suggest you should not be allowed to reproduce.
You ignore the fact I'm being asked to inject formaldehyde and virues grown on aborted fetal cells. YOU are okay with it so you have determined it is okay for me...and your argument about my kid infecting someone is the same about people who do not own gun safes, etc...you want to punish in advance and treat me like I've negligently infected your kid when it has not happened. It is your logic that is flawed...again, your argument assumes that you know it all and the wealth of information on the other side of the argument is 100% false...even if that were the case, you can't expect people to live as 2nd class citizens if they have not harmed anyone, nor can you expect them to do something they believe is not worth the risk to their children. Again, we are at a stalemate and it is you who must attempt to label people the badguys and then launch an offensive against them even if they have not harmed anyone. Sounds like what happened to innocent muslims after 911 who had nothing to do with al queda...you are still on the wrong side of history. If you want penalties for those who harm you then fine, but 100% of people who do not choose vaccines are not harming you. And you also ignore the fact that certain vaccines can cause the person to shed live viruses and could also infect not only the unvaccinated, but the ones who are sick as you describe and have not been able to get vaccines (which if were completely safe it would not matter right?). I believe they are even required to ask you if you are around anyone with a compromised immune system before they give you the live virus vaccine. Why would they ask that? Will you hold the recently vaccinated accountable if they harm immunocompromised people by shedding viruses that replicated from the vaccines and then infecting them?
It is your move to come after us...but you hide behind the bureaucracy to do it and use fear mongering of the public when the actual numbers are not there to support the paranoia to the point of taking people's rights.
Here is the flu nasal spray immunization questionnaire that asks if you live or are near immunocompromised people...you CAN infect them through viral shedding...this also happens with other live virus vaccines...on "outbreak" could be caused by a vaccinated child and then blamed on the unvaccinated...wake up!
http://www.immunize.org/catg.d/p4067.pdf
Tell you what ... Try reading what I just posted and what Dale00 posted backwards and see if that makes sense.
Ain't nun y'all big enuf to forcibly vaccinate my kids OR draft 'em.
Look I understand your point...you guys actually have the better position in the argument. The general public are fearful and easily controlled into going along with whatever the establishment wants them to. We see it on other issues; some of which you and I might actually agree on. But I just want the freedom to say no to violating my religious beliefs or doing anything that I am concerned could be harmful at the hands of the gov't "for the greater good". I am an individual with individual rights and I do not live for the herd mentality. If I thought that the benefit outweighed the risk then I'd make the decision the other way...in our state, there is 99% compliance and regardless of your personal or emotional feelings about vaccines, the chances that my kid will infect yours or anyone's with one of these diseases is low enough that this type of legislation is an overreach. In theory it is easy for you to make your case...all of you. But the few people in this state that have religious or other objections have rights the same as you and their children matter just as much as yours do. There is no polio killing or maiming mass school children in Oklahoma...you'd probably be doing more to protect your kids fro these diseases by calling for legislation to stop illegal immigration into Oklahoma than to try and make your fellow Oklahoman live as 2nd class citizens out of fear with no justifiable merit. If you disagree, then you are the one on offense and you will face resistance to your overreach. Hopefully this sums it up better...again, I do understand why you feel the way you do...I can't fault parents who want to protect their kids from a perceived threat...but that works in both directions.
