Oklahoma HB1059 - SDA Amendment

[mhphoto]

Have there been any issues relating to open carriers? I would've thought that if something did occur it would've been all over the news.

 

[NikatKimber]

My reading is that it does NOT make open carry illegal. Rather, it says that if you carry concealed, it has to be carried concealed.

A. It shall be unlawful for:
1. For any person to carry upon or about his or her person, or
in a purse or other container belonging to the person, any pistol,
revolver, shotgun or rifle whether loaded or unloaded or any dagger,
bowie knife, dirk knife, switchblade knife, spring-type knife, sword
cane, knife having a blade which opens automatically by hand
pressure applied to a button, spring, or other device in the handle
of the knife, blackjack, loaded cane, billy, hand chain, metal
knuckles, or any other offensive weapon, whether such weapon be
concealed or unconcealed, except;
2. For any person without a valid handgun license issued
pursuant to the provisions of the Oklahoma Self-Defense Act to carry
upon or about his or her person or in a purse or other container
belonging to the person, any pistol or revolver; or
3. For any person carrying a handgun with a valid handgun
license issued pursuant to the provision of the Oklahoma Self-
Defense Act to intentionally fail to conceal the handgun within the
meaning of the definition provided for in Section 1290.2 of this
title; provided, however, that accidental exposure of the handgun
shall not constitute an offense under the provisions of this
section.

DEFINITIONS
A. As used in the Oklahoma Self-Defense Act:
1. "Concealed handgun" means a loaded or unloaded pistol
carried hidden from the detection and view of another person either
upon or about the person, in a purse or other container belonging to
the person, or in a vehicle which is operated by the person or in
which the person is riding as a passenger, the presence of which is
not openly discernible to the ordinary observation of a reasonable
person;
2. “Unconcealed handgun” means a loaded or unloaded pistol
carried upon the person in a belt or shoulder holster that is wholly
or partially visible, or carried upon the person in a scabbard or
case designed for carrying firearms that is wholly or partially
visible; and

 

[Keyser328]

Yeah, from what I saw, it would allow SDA holders to keep a weapon in their vehicles on campus without being in violation.

The other big change I saw was in relation to government buildings. From what I can tell, it says it is illegal to carry a weapon into a government building where the primary purpose is to serve the public and said building provides security and metal detectors.

The "and" is the key there, I believe. If it is a public servicing building but doesn't provide security and metal detectors, then I would presume you could carry without question, or at least that is how I read it.

I think that would be to get around the whole "you can't go into the ranger station at the park" type of thing?

It also looks like it does away with the "no parking lot" loophole regarding prisons and as mentioned, schools.



... I'm so glad I never went into law, yeesh.

 

[NikatKimber]

Firecop, my reading says not much would change regarding knives.

A. It shall be unlawful for:
1. For any person to carry upon or about his or her person, or
in a purse or other container belonging to the person, any pistol,
revolver, shotgun or rifle whether loaded or unloaded or any dagger,
bowie knife, dirk knife, switchblade knife, spring-type knife, sword
cane, knife having a blade which opens automatically by hand
pressure applied to a button, spring, or other device in the handle
of the knife, blackjack, loaded cane, billy, hand chain, metal
knuckles, or any other offensive weapon, whether such weapon be
concealed or unconcealed, except;

Bold is my emphasis. The struck out portion is still covered under the bolded section.

 

[jdagreek]

It appears to me that all of you are reading it correctly or close to correctly.

Anyone living in this guys district need to send him letters, make calls and send him emails to politely tell him that you don't like his proposed legislation.

 

[Keyser328]

My reading is that it does NOT make open carry illegal. Rather, it says that if you carry concealed, it has to be carried concealed.

I can see that, though it is a bit ambiguous, really. Accidental exposure of a concealed weapon isn't an issue, but intentional is? I guess that goes with the idea of brandishing/intimidation? I don't know how that would play out. What happens when you conceal with a jacket, but take the jacket off to have dinner and you're not open carrying?

 

[Keyser328]

It appears to me that all of you are reading it correctly or close to correctly.

Anyone living in this guys district need to send him letters, make calls and send him emails to politely tell him that you don't like his proposed legislation.

Most of the changes are good, no? Parking lots would never be off limits for storing a weapon, including schools. Government building are only no-carry zones if they have security and metal detectors.

Basically, they're saying they won't disarm the populous unless they are actively providing protection. I kind of like that idea.

 

[n2sooners]

Hate legalese. They should be required to supplement all bills with a legally binding version in English.

 

[NikatKimber]

Regarding where and where not to carry:

UNLAWFUL CARRY IN CERTAIN PLACES
A. It shall be unlawful for any person in possession of a valid
handgun license issued pursuant to the provisions of the Oklahoma
Self-Defense Act to intentionally, knowingly or recklessly carry any
concealed or unconcealed handgun into any of the following places:
1. Any structure, building, or office space which is owned or
leased by a city, town, county, state, or federal governmental
authority for the primary purpose of conducting business with the
public and that provides authorized security personnel and metal
detectors through which members of the public are required to pass
through;
2. Any meeting of any city, town, county, state or federal
officials, school board members, legislative members, or any other
elected or appointed officials;
3. Any prison, jail, detention facility or any facility used to
process, hold, or house arrested persons, prisoners or persons
alleged delinquent or adjudicated delinquent;
4. Any elementary or secondary school;

My understanding here is that the "intentionally, knowingly, recklessly" would cover you if you had accidentally left something in a bag or your car. Be pretty hard to argue if it was on your body.

As a poster above me inferred, the "primary" means that just because a government entity leases/rents/uses a building for a temporary use, does not mean it is barred. ALSO, for any government building to be barred from carry, they must provide armed security and metal detectors. Another change is it removes the "any meeting of government officials" from the barred list.

The following section I'm not sure I like:

UNLAWFUL CARRY IN CERTAIN PLACES
B. For purposes of paragraphs 1, 2, 3, 5 and 6 4 of subsection
A of this section, the prohibited place does not include and
specifically excludes the following property:
4. Any property designated by a city, town, county, or state,
governmental authority as a park, recreational area, or fairgrounds;
provided, nothing in this paragraph shall be construed to authorize
any entry by a person in possession of a concealed or unconcealed
handgun into any structure, building, or office space which is
specifically prohibited by the provisions of subsection A of this
section.

It looks to be removing the exclusion of parks/fairgrounds from the barred list. That would mean if they put up metal detectors(meaningless on such a large outside event) and armed security (already done), they could legally restrict carry. I don't like that.

 

[NikatKimber]

I can see that, though it is a bit ambiguous, really. Accidental exposure of a concealed weapon isn't an issue, but intentional is? I guess that goes with the idea of brandishing/intimidation? I don't know how that would play out. What happens when you conceal with a jacket, but take the jacket off to have dinner and you're not open carrying?

Not quite. My understanding would be that if you are intending to conceal, but it is obvious you have a gun, then you are outside the law. Concealing with a jacket, then removing at dinner would be changing from concealed to unconcealed.

The idea is that "I'm going to conceal, just not be that concerned with hiding it" won't be allowable. Either conceal it, like you had to before, or open carry it. The difference is that an accidental exposure is no longer a worry.