Syria about to get real ugly

[ignerntbend]

Just a question of what we should do. .
You said earlier that we should keep doing what we are doing. That isn't a slap in anyone's face.
Boils down to a piss poor insult. And I know you can do better than that.

 

[tRidiot]

While I agree with some of the isolationist standpoint of not being the world police and letting people determine their own fate, as someone else said, with great power comes great responsibility. We champion human rights and bemoan dictators who abuse their people, but should we turn a blind eye to the suffering of other people of the world while we sit here fat and happy and live off the imports of 3rd-world nations, with not a care for their people?

I am not advocating getting involved in every petty conflict, but there have been some major atrocities committed in just the last few decades we could have done something about, but went in half-assed or not at all, or just too late. hundreds of thousands if not millions have been slaughtered for religious and cultural differences in Croatia, Sudan, Congo, the Middle East and other places around the world.

Do you think the US should really, as a purported world leader and champion of right, just sit back and tell those people to sort it out themselves?

Not to mention that we live and breathe in a world economy... we may do just fine around here, but uproar around the globe can and does have an effect on our economic stability, as well as availability of products and services. It's not all about monetary gain, but to say what happens elsewhere doesn't affect us in a major way is pretty short-sighted, IMNSHO.

I do not know what the answer is, truly... but I do believe there are points where we have to take a stand to protect not only our own interests (i.e., oil-producing allies), but just stand up and do the right thing for the millions who are suffering every day under unjust regimes.

I dunno... the whole thing just sucks and is beginning to look like one giant turd-bowl.

 

[GlockPride]

I'm having a hard time with this one as I do not like mass murder, but the people that Assad is 'fighting' are not the US's friends. Nor do they have our interests at heart. In fact, they want to see us burn to the ground or worship allah.

That's what most are not seeing is that these are radical islamists that are trying to take over.

So, at the risk of being inflammatory I say we as a country should NOT play policeman in this like we have recently in other countries to strengthen our enemies! Maybe Assad is our 'frienemy'?

 

[Werewolf]

I agree with this. I just worry about innocent civilians caught-up in this mess. When I think of the US, I think with great power comes great responsibility.

In a civil war is there any such thing as innocent civilians.

There are those pro-government - not innocent.
There are those anti-government - not innocent.

And then there are the cowards who won't take a stand - the worst of the lot. They more than any other deserve what they get.

 

[been]

In a civil war is there any such thing as innocent civilians.

There are those pro-government - not innocent.
There are those anti-government - not innocent.

And then there are the cowards who won't take a stand - the worst of the lot. They more than any other deserve what they get.

what about women and children?

 

[Hobbes]

what about women and children?

That's what we call collateral damage.

 

[Werewolf]

what about women and children?

What about them? War is a nasty business. People get killed - among them women and children. That's one of the things that makes war an option of last resort.

Clean up war so that only soldiers die and war becomes a less painful option and occurs more often.

Does anyone think the US would have been so quick to jump into all the wars we've been involved in since the 1960's if it involved our women and children getting killed?

Well - Do you?

 

[Hobbes]

International Concern Mounts Over Syria's Chemical Weapons

December 05, 2012

by Michael Lipin

As U.S. officials raise the alarm about perceived Syrian government preparations to use chemical weapons in the country’s civil war, some analysts see those weapons playing other roles in the conflict.

They say the United States and its allies also are weighing several options and risks in planning their response to the threat of chemical warfare in Syria.

The threat appeared to grow Monday as U.S. officials said intelligence sources detected moves by Syrian authorities to combine the components of the nerve agent sarin.

They said it was not clear if Syrian President Bashar al-Assad has decided to deploy deadly sarin gas against rebels trying to end his 12-year rule. But U.S. President Barack Obama warned that Assad would be held accountable if he takes such a step, without saying how Washington would respond.

Suspected stockpiles

Western security analysts believe Syria also has stockpiles of VX gas, a deadlier nerve agent, and mustard gas, a blistering agent that usually is not lethal.

They say Syria’s arsenal is tightly guarded by Assad loyalists at several sites around the country, including the capital, Damascus, and the cities of Hama, Homs, Latakia and al-Safir.

Syria has not denied possessing chemical weapons and has not signed an international convention banning their use. But, Damascus has said it would never deploy such munitions against its own people.

Assad’s pledge

Dave Hartwell, a Middle East researcher at IHS Jane’s in London, said he doubts the Syrian president would violate that pledge.

"Mr. Assad is not Saddam Hussein," noted Hartwell. "He is a very different type of ruler, not as dictatorial in the cruel sense."

The deposed Iraqi leader’s forces killed thousands of minority Iraqi Kurds in a 1988 chemical attack on the northeastern city of Halabja.

Negotiating tactic?

Hartwell said Assad appears to be keeping Syria’s chemical weapons in reserve as a bargaining chip with Western and Arab powers who want him ousted.

"Perhaps [he wants] to negotiate some form of surrender or some form of handover [of the weapons] to international authorities in exchange for immunity from prosecution in the future," he said.

Al-Qaida’s role

Hartwell said the West is more concerned about the risk of Syria’s chemical weapons falling into the hands of al-Qaida-linked Islamist militants who have joined the fight against Assad.

Dany Shoham, a researcher at Israel’s Begin-Sadat Center for Strategic Studies, said he believes Assad would act to prevent al-Qaida from capturing and using the chemical agents.

"If his regime is about to fall, most probably he would prefer to ‘rescue’ those weapons and let [his] Iranian [allies] have them," said Shoham.

He said another possibility is that Assad would transfer chemical munitions to his Lebanese ally Hezbollah, a militant group that dominates Lebanon’s government.

US options

Hartwell said any attempt by the United States and its allies to secure Syria’s chemical weapons and prevent their use or transfer would require sending in ground troops to guard the stockpiles.

He said one option would be for the U.S. military to enter Syria, perhaps with special operations forces such as those sent to neighboring Jordan earlier this year to train Jordanian troops.

The Obama administration previously has expressed a reluctance to intervene in such a way, fearing that could exacerbate Syria’s fighting and plunge the United States into another costly Iraq-style war.

"[Washington] also could provide logistical back-up or transport for troops from other countries to go in, perhaps from Jordan or Turkey," said Hartwell.

Intervention risks

But Western military planners also face two major hazards in Syria.

Israeli researcher Shoham said one possibility is that Assad would be provoked into using his remaining chemical arsenal against the invading forces.

"Another risk is that there would be a massive environmental contamination from attacking those weapons and trying to destroy them," he said.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/syria/2012/syria-121205-voa02.htm

 

[ez bake]

I got to this part:

...with my troll inside of your troll wrapped in this last troll?

...and forgot what this thread was about.

Actually... Thanks Uncle money and Ignernt. I don't think I wanted to read it anyways.

 

[11b1776]

America is damned if we do damned if we don't. If we went in and took over we would be bullying another country with our war machine, and if we don't we are letting the innocents die just standing by watching. Let someone else take the lead.