The official " will israel do it " discussion

[Boehlertaught]

he is, look how hard they fought for falluja. Ill give em this, they love the holy sites.

You better hope so because when these numb nuts decide to do something I think their sensibility goes out the door. I've got now doubts Israel can beat the crap out of Iran by themselves...they can kick a$$. I suspect most of Iran's infrastructure to make war, actually repel an attack, would be destroyed in a "pre-attack" night raid that would cripple all the plans, trains and automobiles Israel thought was a threat. Would we help them in the covert action. Probably. Would be get directly involved on a mass basis like we have in Iraq & Afghanistan? Not sure but I lean toward it just over 50%.
Bottom line is this. Nothing we do there will matter in the long run. It hasn't in Iraq, they are still all f'd up and I think it's just going to get worse. We're only marginally doing better in Afghanistan than Russia did...and I think Afghanistan will return to their old ways...the only way they know...faster than Iraq. The people over there have been at this type of action longer than man first started to scratch his first language on a rock. They're not going to change.

 

[uncle money bags]

You better hope so because when these numb nuts decide to do something I think their sensibility goes out the door. I've got now doubts Israel can beat the crap out of Iran by themselves...they can kick a$$. I suspect most of Iran's infrastructure to make war, actually repel an attack, would be destroyed in a "pre-attack" night raid that would cripple all the plans, trains and automobiles Israel thought was a threat. Would we help them in the covert action. Probably. Would be get directly involved on a mass basis like we have in Iraq & Afghanistan? Not sure but I lean toward it just over 50%.
Bottom line is this. Nothing we do there will matter in the long run. It hasn't in Iraq, they are still all f'd up and I think it's just going to get worse. We're only marginally doing better in Afghanistan than Russia did...and I think Afghanistan will return to their old ways...the only way they know...faster than Iraq. The people over there have been at this type of action longer than man first started to scratch his first language on a rock. They're not going to change.

No argument here on anything you said. It would take generations of effort to effect any kind of change in that part of the world. It's not like we are starting with a civilized population that values human rights as a basis for conducting business. that would need to happen before any reasonable expectation of societal change could begin to happen.

 

[Boehlertaught]

No argument here on anything you said. It would take generations of effort to effect any kind of change in that part of the world. It's not like we are starting with a civilized population that values human rights as a basis for conducting business. that would need to happen before any reasonable expectation of societal change could begin to happen.

I don't really know much about the way of life of the folks in these countries; any more than any other natural born American. But what I do know agrees with you on the human rights values issue. For change to happen, I'm not sure you can count the necessary generations on all of your fingers though. I think I do understand one part of their thinking. They probably look at us and say the same thing you said. They probably wonder why we think differently than they do and condem our actions. And remember, a point of view is something folks learn from the previous generations. A Vulcan mind meld is probably the best thing to do to the entire population.

 

[carry guy]

There's a bigger agenda going on with Africa/the Middle East, The Nato powers (G.B,. USA. France) are totally invested in remaking the middle east. Their unofficial game plan can be found in the Project For A New American Centruey documents, which were prepared well before 9/11 and the invasion of Iraq. So far we have had Tunisia, C'ote d'Ivoire, Egypt, and Libya.
All based on Responsibility to Protect, the new United Nattions document which was approved around 2005 and has been used as the basis for intervention. For hundreds of years before that, the Western powers adhered to the Treaties of Westphalia, circa 1649-1649. These Wesphalian treaties basically stood for the point that the internal affairs of a foreign country were just that--their internal affairs, and did not furnish a rationale to pick sides and/or invade.

Fact is, the Department of State (hillary's doman) began inviting key players from these countries and set them up in classrooms so as to learn things such as how to engineer an Arab Spring. Sio far, for all the initital talk of freedom for the little guy, what we have wound up with is major civilian casualties in Libya, the razing of entire cities inhabited by blacks under the guidance and armaments of Al Quaeda, and the installation of a central bank of Libya. In Egypt, the Musbarik regime was overthrown and a military government took over. Both the ruling elites of Libya and Egypt have fallen into the hands of the Moslem Brotherhood, an organization with deep ties to both the CIA and City of London (the financial district referred to as a city within London, not London proper).

Now, onto Syria. It is a country currently ruled by a harsh dictator, Assad. Under Assacd,. Syria has provided a home for Muslims, Christians, and Jews, the latter two forming a distinct minority with many ancient buildings of worship. Enter the so-called "Free Syrian Army." These are portrayed as locals who took up arms against Assad, but the FSA is really an umberella organization. Major componenets are Al Qaedda, many of whom fought in Iraq against US troops and in Libya against Gaddafi. Now, they have been moved to Syria. It is also no secret that the rebels/insurrectionists have been the benediciaries of Saudi and Turkish, as well as US arms. The rebel forces have the nasty habit of killing the elderly, women, and children as well as military age males; they also burn to the ground Christian churches and Jewish synagogues, unlike the Assad forces.

We here is the West have access to the Associated Press and Reuters as news sources. No surprise, they put forward the propaganda stories of their favored "activists" and retractions, iif any, occur in lower distaant back pages. The Reuters organization has been owned and controlled by the Rosthchild banking interests for around a century. Since the Rothschilds have been infamous for arming both sides in wars, they usually have no large stake in the outcome, figuring that both the winning and losing side will be their debtors.

Now, let's take a look at Iran. The West overhtrew their democratically eleceted leadeer in the early 1950's and installed the Shah of Iran. He began getting testy against werstern interests in the mid 1970's. The Shah was deposes by popular crowds. amd tje Ayatollah Khomeini was flown from Paris to Tehran, to take over the country and install a fundamentalist Muslim government. Unknown to many, the Ayatollah Khomeini was hand-picked by the CIA to become the next ruler of Iran.

Under his leadership, Iran would not be swayed to behave as OpEC members, in accepting only dollars for oil sales. It must be remembered, that Nixon cut the official link between dolars and redeemable gold for dollars in 1971. Another method had tobe created to force the rest of the world to use dollars. Thus, any time., any nation needed tp sell oil, they had to use dollars for the tranaction.

Currently, Iran is recieving payment for oil exports to China in gold.k It just so happens that Canada has withrawn their diplomats in Irand. Netanyahu ( apart fro, the sentiments of the bulk of Israelis) is pushing tor war against Iran. All over something they suspect Iran has that Israel has already had for a long time.i
And here we are in the USA. Latest employment numbers reduced the unemployment rate simply becaise of workers who have dropped out from the pool the Labor Deoartment measures.

Folks, we are sitting here right before an election year for the President of the United States. I could easilly blow of voting for president. I sill may. Just understand, whomever you elect will be sorely tempted to rule through executive orders that no one had a chance to vote for or against. Just remembember that Syria is a sovereign power under attack by rebels from other counriess. Just remenber the USA sgould not be your role model;. that we are tryking to get our voices out despigte this inhumane organiztion. Dear foreigners. I am tryin to spldge my mind, my sould, and my sense of freedom to you/ Please never fporget that a lover of humanity risked it all to send you a message of love and solidaity. May God bless you, ,my friends. May God bless the decisions you make. Please remember our Christ told us that we would have no rewards here, but ra ther in the kingdom of heaven. aNo matter how strong you may have tought the USA id, plese vote on the side of what Gpd males a[[ear om upir jearts/ NHOT WHat we necessarily ask or. God is great and Gid is beautriful. God bless you and prayers you do not succuumb to the idolaterer.

 

[RickN]

Hmmm that is the most propaganda I have seen in one post in a long time.

 

[cjjtulsa]

At what point do you believe we should intervene?

After Israel is gone?

Israel is a sovereign nation, and the third largest nuclear power on earth. We shouldn't intervene - at all. You can send your kids to die for them, I'll keep mine here - thanks.

When Europe is attacked by some " conventional military "?

Is there an impending threat of that?

When U.S. soil is invaded?

Yes, or at least this is your best scenario for why we should get involved in any military action. This is the reason we have a "Department of Defense".

When Americans are being killed by Iranian soldiers somewhere?

The problem, as I see it, is there are a substantial number of people; with the support of nations, at war with the U.S. and we are ignoring it instead of killing them. waiting until they develop a substantive means to effectively bring the fight here, to our home land, before we " go fight for a patch of sand" is historically ignorant. If it was all about a patch of sand why give it back to their people after we defeat the enemy?

Last I checked, it's Americans that are in their neigborhood blowing **** up and shooting people, not Iranian soldiers in our neighborhood doing that. Who's at war with who? What have the Iranians done to us, exactly? Since 1979, anyway? Don't Americans even realize just a little bit that they are victims of propaganda on a massive scale? Our press tells the morons in this country that "so-and-so" is our enemy, and we all clamor to turn them and their countries into a "glass parking lot". What makes us so different from some of those of the 1930s and 1940s that were led to believe some were their enemy, and needed to be eliminated? If people would pause just long enough to look into it, they'd see that the Iranian people actually don't hate us, and kind of like some of our western ways. So we should "nuke" them because their leaders and Israel's leaders hate each other? And that's a good excuse for us to send our kids there to die en masse? Christ sakes, people; look at the bigger picture. We're being played for many reasons, some of which we don't even know. Our real enemies are D.C., Tel Aviv, and Tehran, not the people at their mercy.

On the issue of nukes, The only way I see Israel using nukes is at the point they have zero other alternative, and I dont see the rest of the world, including us, letting it get to that point.

God, I hope you're right. And God help us if you're wrong.

 

[David2012]

I seriously doubt that anyone would ever nuke Israel. To do so, they'd have to take out Jerusalem and make it a perpetual hot zone. All three major religions consider Jerusalem a holy site. While the bad actors may want the Jews gone from there, none of them wants to eliminate the place itself.

The bad actors can get hold of tactical nukes from N. Korea, Russia, China and other places. They have them that can be fired from artillery cannons. Can knock out say 1/2- 1 mile radius. The artillery cannon Atomic Annie was on display at Ft. Sill if I remember right. And while the U.S. has agreed not to use Neutron bombs [which we developed], other countries have not made such a agreement. Neutron bombs don't have the radiation problems that traditional nukes have.

 

[ronny]

It's amazing how many people simply ignore all the threats made by radical Muslim governments, not to mention terror groups, which specifically state that their ultimate goal is to irradicate Israel. Their interpretation of their holy book requires them to do just that. They view their holy book in a completely different light than most Christians today view their own. They're also very patient.

 

[David2012]

+1. Iran's Mullahs have openly stated they don't care if it means all their deaths if they can destroy Israel. Including Jerusalem. If they die, they think they go to heaven. They are true believers. Much more so than most 'Christians'. They believe they have to bring about a world war in order to bring back their Madi from the well.

 

[Biggsly]

Every man has the right and duty to protect himself and his family from someone that wants to kill them, regaurdless what anyone else thinks.