for hunters - 30-06 VS 308

[Grumulkin]

Here is how I see it - stretching your hunting distance 3,4,5 times of the acceptable average serves only one purpose: purely egoistic bragging rights - be it to yourself, family, friends, internet. Since the decision is egoistic it is unethical by definition.

You're being a bit judgmental aren't you. Pray tell, where did you learn what the "acceptable average" is and how do you know that those who shoot at ranges you believe are beyond the "acceptable average" are doing so for "purely egoistic bragging rights"?

Perhaps you've heard the term "fair chase"? It means the animal has a chance to get away in case you don't know. It would seem to me that attempting to take an animal at 500 yards where it had an extra half second to get away would be in the spirit of fair chase.

If you really want to be "ethical" and guarantee a clean kill EVERY time, you probably better tighten up the range and make sure the animal is in a pen. Oh, but I guess that's how the meat gets on the supermarket shelf.

 

[MoBoost]

You're being a bit judgmental aren't you. Pray tell, where did you learn what the "acceptable average" is and how do you know that those who shoot at ranges you believe are beyond the "acceptable average" are doing so for "purely egoistic bragging rights"?

Again, you are just arguing with me. If you don't think that 100-200 yard is an acceptable range in Oklahoma on white tail deer - tell us what range is! If you think that long range hunting is done for other reasons - TELL US! Do not argue for a sake of arguing.

Perhaps you've heard the term "fair chase"? It means the animal has a chance to get away in case you don't know. It would seem to me that attempting to take an animal at 500 yards where it had an extra half second to get away would be in the spirit of fair chase.

Sir, if you are going to lecture me on "terms", please at least have a decency of looking them up. You have left out the key part of "fair chase": giving an animal a fair chance of escape UNHARMED. Half a second "delay" does exactly the opposite.

 

[OKCShooter]

I have to say, although there is no way to label a shot as ethical or unethical, it is obvious that a 500 yard shot is less ethical versus a 100 yard shot.

As a hunter, I would not feel that it is responsible to take such a long shot.

 

[Grumulkin]

Again, you are just arguing with me. If you don't think that 100-200 yard is an acceptable range in Oklahoma on white tail deer - tell us what range is! If you think that long range hunting is done for other reasons - TELL US! Do not argue for a sake of arguing.


Sir, if you are going to lecture me on "terms", please at least have a decency of looking them up. You have left out the key part of "fair chase": giving an animal a fair chance of escape UNHARMED. Half a second "delay" does exactly the opposite.

I think 100 to 200 yards is an "acceptable range" in OK and elsewhere for whitetail deer. I also think 400 or 500 yards is an acceptable range for some riflemen equipped with some rifles. Your error is in not recognizing the fact that what may be an acceptable shot for you may not be for someone else and vice versa. One or two hundred yards may be stretching the talents of some.

Someone in this thread made the point of a half second or so bullet delay in reaching the animal being a critical factor in long range shooting. If it's that critical, then that half second should assist the creature in escaping unscathed.

 

[338Shooter]

I long range hunt with nothing less than 338 Lapua.

 

[ez bake]

.338LM is for wussies...

 

[30BulletHoles]

At 50 you can go to the shot spot and find blood trail and track - at 500 will never find that spot, so tracking is not an option.


I do bow hunt and had a deer jump the string; none of that affects the bullet flight and deer doing unpredictable stuff in that time.


Outside the scope of the discussion, I don't need to engage in any unethical behavior to call it such.

I do varmint long range hunt; big game I prefer to get as close as possible. Note in Oklahoma deer "hunting" season is 3.5 months long, it's the "shooting" season that is only 3 weeks.

I don't know why you are so wound up - I said I don't have a problem with long range hunting, I just don't think ethical; just like strip bars are unethical, but perfectly legal and accepted, and I don't have a problem with people going there - I just choose not to.

Finding blood and dead game isn't hard at a distance if you look at the surroundings as well as the game in question. I never pull the trigger on any deer at any distance without knowing exactly where it stands and whats around it. After the shot, whether with bow, black powder, rifle I will walk to the exact spot where the deer was standing and will track from there, if its not dead right there. Same amount of flight time at close range with a bow at close distance as with a rifle at long distance. I don't take "long" shots unless I don't think I can make a stalk to get closer, if I don't have optimum conditions then I'll take the best shot that I'm comfortable with.

I believe the question of "ethics" in hunting depends on many factors, as well as personal opinion. I see that you have your opinion and I have presented the case for mine.
At rest.

How does taking a shot to test your skills in hunting make it uneathical. Its good practice for whatever events could occure in the united states and closed minedness about a particular hunting style shows that you dont understand that during most non urban combat that those ranges would be average to be shooting and you think that it is for bragging only.

Practicing SHTF scenerios on game animals is assinine. Statements like this are what make people like me crazy. Hunting isn't practice for the end of the world.

 

[CHenry]

I killed 3 deer at 275 yards (not quite 500) from a hilltop overlooking 160 acres. They scattered when the first one dropped and ran in different directions and then stopped again. The second shot didnt even spook them again so I was able to kill 3 total.
All neck shots - thats the key, If I miss, no wounded deer but If I get any part of that neck, they go down like a sack of rocks.
Oh and there were 3 of us hunting trying to fill our tags on the last day of rifle.

 

[Lone Wolf '49]

Well, this old guy wasn't even going to say anything and I had not read the thread until a fellow OSAer called and suggested I post or repost the experience I had last year on opening day of deer rifle. I had always used an M1A for deer hunting and never had a shot over 75 or so yards. Last year I bought my first center fire bolt rifle. Put a Leupold 2.5 X 8 VariX III and decided to use the Hornady Superformance 308 Win 150 grain sst bullet for it and never tried anything else. Good friend, and more knowledgeable than myself helped me zero it in at 200 yds. Opening day last year of rifle deer I was near Lake Creek on my uncle's place. Killed a doe at sunrise, killed another doe at about 415 PM, both 80 yds or less, thought that is it I am old and tired going to the house, driving back towards the house I saw a fat buck, 8 point on the ridge just outside of the treeline watching my old red Toyota pickup so I stopped, and he stands there watching. I have a Redfield ranger finder good to 550 yds, so I pulled it out and it says 453 yds. I had seen the buck the evening before opening day and thought I will never see him again. All day as I sat I kept looking at the box of ammo, zero 200 drop at 400 is 20.1 inches. I opened the door of the truck window down and laid the rifle on the window sill. Raise it the scope up about 12 inches above the shoulder, I think. Fired, after recoil all I saw was the right rear leg of the buck sticking up. Got in the truck, drove up there and by God he was laying right there. I am old and after taking care of the two does and out of shape he was so fat I couldn't get him in the bed of the truck, but that is another story. Great rifle, scope and ammo, make things possible. Maybe I should add that the rifle is a Sako 85 Finnlite.

 

[MoBoost]

Cool story!

Isn't shooting from vehicles prohibited? Not helping the whole ethics thing here....