A SWAT Raid Based On Faulty Info Kills a Man Over His ‘Huge Stash.’ Worth Maybe $2

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SoonerP226

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The guys on the raid know (or should know) that kicking in a guy's door based on intel gleaned from a crook for a victimless crime, and then shooting him for attempting to exercise his God given right to defend himself from an unknown entity that's breaking down his door is heinously wrong.
I didn't say anything about right or wrong, just legal and illegal. Serving a no-knock warrant may or may not be wrong, but it is not, in and of itself, illegal. Likewise, I'm pretty sure if you go back and look at the Nuremberg verdicts, you'll find that they were convicted for violating specific laws and treaty terms, not for doing something that was "heinously wrong."
 

Glocktogo

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The guys on the raid know (or should know) that kicking in a guy's door based on intel gleaned from a crook for a victimless crime, and then shooting him for attempting to exercise his God given right to defend himself from an unknown entity that's breaking down his door is heinously wrong.

How do you know the raid team point elements knew the intel came from a crook and could likely be faulty? They are just acting on a warrant signed by a judge. That's like expecting the pharmacist to know that the doctor who prescribed a medication that killed a patient was a terrible doctor, and therefore they shouldn't have prescribed the medication. :screwy:
 

dennishoddy

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The use of snitches is the main issue.
What I found out in my $12,000 Journey through the legal system with my son that caught a ride with some guys to get home from a bar in OKC was that snitches are paid for each "bust" no matter if they are found innocent or guilty.
No matter all three testified that my son was an innocent bystander he was found guilty in court of complicity by association. What a broad brush that could cover anything to get some court costs.
Paying snitches and the justification to use a no-knock invasion of privacy certainly falls on the Judge and the individual that doesn't use proper police investigative procedures to make sure the correct location is being entered.

I agree with an earlier post that said these small offense crimes are a training ground for SWAT teams. Sadly this training exercise resulted in an innocent death.
 

_CY_

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more details from the newspaper that did an informal investigation ...

http://www.tampabay.com/news/public...laints-led-up-to-fatal-tampa-pot-raid/2187316

http://www.tampabay.com/news/public...blows-whistle-in-jason-westcott-death/2211596

http://www.tampabay.com/news/public...wat-team-acted-properly-in-fatal-raid/2193215

'Not an exact science'

Last month, the Hillsborough State Attorney's Office concluded after a review that the two police officers who shot at Westcott — Cpl. Eric Wasierski and Officer Edwin Perez — were justified in the use of deadly force.

In an interview with the Times, Tampa police Chief Jane Castor defended the drug investigation at 906 W Knollwood and said she has seen no signs that the officers who killed Westcott acted inappropriately.

"Mr. Westcott lost his life because he aimed a loaded firearm at police officers. You can take the entire marijuana issue out of the picture," Castor said. "If there's an indication that there is armed trafficking going on — someone selling narcotics while they are armed or have the ability to use a firearm — then the tactical response team will do the initial entry."
 
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SgtMojo67

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There's a reason no knock warrants are served usually overnight. If you are serving a warrant mid day and bad guy comes out and sees the police, there is a greater chance of suspect running back in and now you have an armed and barricaded situation that could also have hostages depending on who is inside. Common sense would tell you the idea of doing it when people are sleeping is you make entry with the element of surprise and them being sleepy/disoriented you can secure the house quickly and safely and there is a lesser risk of things going south. Now I wasn't there so I won't speak for this situation. Yes the information should have been checked and rechecked. Surveillance should have been done to make sure your suspect is seen coming and going etc etc......Those at fault should have to answer for their actions. Now being that I wasn't there, I can tell you from experience serving on a SWAT team, a no knock means you don't announce yourself BEFORE you make entry. In my experiences and the "raids" I've gone on, once entry is made, officer's are SHOUTING police search warrant over and over. When we would make entry, a marked police unit would pull up right in front of the house with lights on and an officer simultaneously making announcements over a PA system. That way there is no doubt who is entering the home...Anyhow, as always with this forum, there are a few on here that are anti law enforcement and NOTHING that is said will make you happy......I'm surprised I'm even responding to this thread....:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2


I would LOVE to see some of you armchair quarterbacks take on this training....That way we can SEE how you respond rather than hear you say, "If I was that officer I would have done this".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfi3Ndh3n-g
 

jrusling

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There's a reason no knock warrants are served usually overnight. If you are serving a warrant mid day and bad guy comes out and sees the police, there is a greater chance of suspect running back in and now you have an armed and barricaded situation that could also have hostages depending on who is inside. Common sense would tell you the idea of doing it when people are sleeping is you make entry with the element of surprise and them being sleepy/disoriented you can secure the house quickly and safely and there is a lesser risk of things going south. Now I wasn't there so I won't speak for this situation. Yes the information should have been checked and rechecked. Surveillance should have been done to make sure your suspect is seen coming and going etc etc......Those at fault should have to answer for their actions. Now being that I wasn't there, I can tell you from experience serving on a SWAT team, a no knock means you don't announce yourself BEFORE you make entry. In my experiences and the "raids" I've gone on, once entry is made, officer's are SHOUTING police search warrant over and over. When we would make entry, a marked police unit would pull up right in front of the house with lights on and an officer simultaneously making announcements over a PA system. That way there is no doubt who is entering the home...Anyhow, as always with this forum, there are a few on here that are anti law enforcement and NOTHING that is said will make you happy......I'm surprised I'm even responding to this thread....:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2


I would LOVE to see some of you armchair quarterbacks take on this training....That way we can SEE how you respond rather than hear you say, "If I was that officer I would have done this".

I still have a problem with this except as a last resort. If I am woke up by someone busting in the door, they will probably have lead coming their way. I could not see a car from the bedroom and anyone can yell "Police". There are cases where the bad guys did just that. When you are awakened from a sleep you will not have very much time to decide what to do. Since I don't do anything that would come close to giving the police a reason to do a no knock, I will assume that it is home invaders breaking down the door. If it is the police then I will probably be dead as well as my wife.
 

OKCShooter

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I still have a problem with this except as a last resort. If I am woke up by someone busting in the door, they will probably have lead coming their way. I could not see a car from the bedroom and anyone can yell "Police". There are cases where the bad guys did just that. When you are awakened from a sleep you will not have very much time to decide what to do. Since I don't do anything that would come close to giving the police a reason to do a no knock, I will assume that it is home invaders breaking down the door. If it is the police then I will probably be dead as well as my wife.

Exactly my sentiments. As someone with no reason for SWAT to be entering my home (remember, the man that was murdered had no reason to expect Police invasion) I would be shooting before believing an intruder is a PO just because they're yelling it.

If this happened to me, I hope that there are criminal charges pressed against everyone involved in PLANNING this raid.

Seriously, how hard is it to investigate something that (in the Police's eyes) requires night raids?

If a turd informants 'info' can't be confirmed than wait until it can/cannot before doing this kind of crap...
 

Lurker66

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There's a reason no knock warrants are served usually overnight. If you are serving a warrant mid day and bad guy comes out and sees the police, there is a greater chance of suspect running back in and now you have an armed and barricaded situation that could also have hostages depending on who is inside. Common sense would tell you the idea of doing it when people are sleeping is you make entry with the element of surprise and them being sleepy/disoriented you can secure the house quickly and safely and there is a lesser risk of things going south. Now I wasn't there so I won't speak for this situation. Yes the information should have been checked and rechecked. Surveillance should have been done to make sure your suspect is seen coming and going etc etc......Those at fault should have to answer for their actions. Now being that I wasn't there, I can tell you from experience serving on a SWAT team, a no knock means you don't announce yourself BEFORE you make entry. In my experiences and the "raids" I've gone on, once entry is made, officer's are SHOUTING police search warrant over and over. When we would make entry, a marked police unit would pull up right in front of the house with lights on and an officer simultaneously making announcements over a PA system. That way there is no doubt who is entering the home...Anyhow, as always with this forum, there are a few on here that are anti law enforcement and NOTHING that is said will make you happy......I'm surprised I'm even responding to this thread....:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2:rolleyes2


I would LOVE to see some of you armchair quarterbacks take on this training....That way we can SEE how you respond rather than hear you say, "If I was that officer I would have done this".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfi3Ndh3n-g

problem is this. We ain't armchair quarter backing. We ain't Swat. We are citizens that you work for. We hire you to protect our rights and enforce our laws. We hold you to a high standard. We see a problem with no knock warrants and we see problems with busting down doors, yelling "cops with warrant", shooting citizens and getting off Scott free when yall acted on wrong info.

Today the law us on your side and your protected, eventually you'll end up on the defendant side of the courtroom. That's what's gonna happen if ya don't get it right.
 

OKCShooter

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problem is this. We ain't armchair quarter backing. We ain't Swat. We are citizens that you work for. We hire you to protect our rights and enforce our laws. We hold you to a high standard. We see a problem with no knock warrants and we see problems with busting down doors, yelling "cops with warrant", shooting citizens and getting off Scott free when yall acted on wrong info.

Today the law us on your side and your protected, eventually you'll end up on the defendant side of the courtroom. That's what's gonna happen if ya don't get it right.


Heck, screw the high standard, I just want them to do some BASIC due diligence before crashing into my house at night.
 

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