FBI switching to 9mm

[twoguns?]

THIS is a 44 magnum, The most powerful handgun on the planet...Ya gotta ask yourself one question...Do You Feel Lucky ...Punk?

 

[BadgeBunny]

THIS is a 44 magnum, The most powerful handgun on the planet...Ya gotta ask yourself one question...Do You Feel Lucky ...Punk?

I wish you'd posted that about 340 posts earlier ...

 

[ASP785]

I am curious what the 45 caliber advocates split times are? I can run about a .17 accurately at about 15 yards or less and keep it in the A zone with a G34

I think this is important to discuss. With my FNP 45, I'm in the .24+ range. This could quite possibly be a training problem, since I don't shoot it all that often. Split times are important, especially if you miss and everyone including those on the internet, misses occasionally.

I really would like to know what some of you 45 guys' split times are...

 

[dennishoddy]

I wish you'd posted that about 340 posts earlier ...

Since its not other than in the movies....

I did impress some guys at the Wilshire Gun Range letting them shoot my .44 Super Redhawk with full power loads. They had never shot a magnum round before. The fireball is magnificent.

 

[mightymouse]

The only thing I'm sure of here is that the FBI could care less what the consensus opinion of OSA is on their decision to go back to the 9mm. The definitive study by the Bureau on that very subject is due to be released in a matter of weeks.

News Flash: The Definitive Study has just been posted on the link provided: www.fartbarfanditch.com. The conclusion is as follows: the FBI does not care what OSA thinks about its decision to switch calibers.

 

[OKCShooter]

I really would like to know what some of you 45 guys' split times are...

They don't need split times...

With a .45 you only need to shoot once.

 

[dennishoddy]

They don't need split times...

With a .45 you only need to shoot once.

Welcome aboard!

 

[MoBoost]

I first fell in love with SiG pistols in 1976

Sorry, boss, you used a word love describing a sidearm - we are totally on different pages. I got some pretty cool guns in the safe myself - but the one on my hip is a TOOL, and I don't have feelings about the tool - it either works or doesn't.

Pictures wouldn't serve any purpose because skill is about the shooter, not the gun. Besides, I really couldn't care less what you think about my credibility.

Shooter's skill is a tool just like the gun - you can't make one more important than the other: bad gun in good hands is no different than a good gun in bad hands.

A good round of speed chess is as stressful, but neither comes close to the kind of stress involved in a real life shooting scenario.

I am not a cop; I do not want to be in a shootout; I am not planning to be in one and most likely will go through my life without one. I tried bullseye and it wasn't good training for me. I tried USPSA - and it clicked it as a good test for my tools - both guns and my shooting. I've tried many different guns in different calibers last couple of years and made my own observations and conclusions on what guns work the best and why.

But that's okay, I bow to your superior knowledge, experience, ability, intelligence, good looks, health, wealth, eye color, and anything else you want - I can tell from your posts that you're quite obviously the #1 shooter on OSA.

Well, thank you. At least we agree on something finally.

I do shoot 4 matches every month in 3 different disciplines - to tell you the truth I don't see familiar faces across the board: but I like to keep my mind and horizons open.

 

[farmerbyron]

You miss the point - I wasn't arguing the value of competition as a training tool, just the "stress" part. A good round of speed chess is as stressful, but neither comes close to the kind of stress involved in a real life shooting scenario.

No doubt a 2 way range is going to exponentially increase the stress levels during a shoot. I cannot imagine the adrenaline dump experienced during such an event. Given this understood fact, wouldn't you say that your accuracy will suffer to a pretty large degree over what it would on your practice range? If we know your accuracy will suffer under duress, would you rather your gun run dry after 7 rounds or 15?


I suspect your counter argument will be that you would rather the rounds that connected would do more damage than the higher capacity caliber. Here in lies the rub. The difference in terminal performance is minimal between the major handgun calibers. You may not believe it due to previously held beliefs or machismo but many tests and real world examples show it to be true.


http://www.policemag.com/channel/weapons/articles/2013/01/stopping-power-myths-legends-and-realities.aspx
The point here is that no single ammunition that is typically used by law enforcement officers today can reliably claim to have superior stopping power.

I have seen a .22 caliber bullet completely incapacitate someone and a .45 ACP fail to achieve that result. People and animals shot with 10mm rounds and .357 SIG rounds have continued to run from the police. I have been on scene as a tactical medical provider when a suicidal person shot himself in the head with a .45 Colt round resulting in instant death. And I have seen the same results in suicides that used smaller calibers, including .22, .25, and .32. I have also seen people hit with 9mm, .40, and .45 without so much as staggering or slowing their verbal or physical activities.

So we come back to the original question: Which ammunition has the best stopping power? I can't answer that question. What I can say is that you should look for ammunition that reliably lives up to its claims of penetration and expansion but don't believe that these two factors alone are related to stopping power.

The ultimate stopping power rests with your training with your weapon system. Accurate hits in any reasonable caliber will "stop" a person if that person has experienced enough brain or spinal cord damage to interrupt regular neurologic impulses from reaching vital areas of the body or the person has hemorrhaged enough blood to lower his or her blood pressure where the brain no longer is able to function well. You can also stop a person if a major bone shatters after a bullet injures it, but does that stop the fight?

 

[kansas45]

Since its not other than in the movies....

I did impress some guys at the Wilshire Gun Range letting them shoot my .44 Super Redhawk with full power loads. They had never shot a magnum round before. The fireball is magnificent.

The fireball IS magnificent!
I shot my Super Black Hawk on a moonless night, it was exactly midnight, as I recall.
It looked like a cutting torch was coming out of the muzzel! Very impressive.