How to Understand Georgia's 'Guns Everywhere' Law: Four Blunt Points

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Old Fart

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Oct 29, 2008
Messages
22,400
Reaction score
6
Location
XXX
Article: http://www.businessweek.com/article...ywhere-law-four-blunt-points?campaign_id=yhoo


Georgia appears poised to enact a so-called guns-everywhere law, making it easier for firearm permit holders to take their weapons into bars, churches, and even airports. Approved last week by the state legislature, the bill awaits the signature of Republican Governor Nathan Deal, a strong gun-rights advocate up for reelection this fall. His opponent, Jason Carter, a Democratic state senator and grandson of former President Jimmy Carter, voted for the legislation, so enactment seems assured.

Non-gun owners doubtless find all this baffling. Here are four blunt points to sort out what’s going on and how to respond:

1. The Newtown school massacre led to “guns everywhere.” Perverse as it may sound, the horrific mass shooting in December 2012 at Sandy Hook Elementary produced a burst of state-level gun control bills around the country and then triggered a much stronger pro-gun backlash. The counter-reaction has now reached its apogee in Georgia. In the past year alone, 21 states have enacted laws expanding gun rights, according to the Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence. Several states added piecemeal provisions allowing firearms on college campuses or in bars or churches. Georgia’s politicians, egged on by the National Rifle Association, have gone for broke.


2. Georgia illustrates the NRA’s structural advantage on gun control.
As if we needed a fresh demonstration of this phenomenon, the gun-rights lobby currently enjoys a fundamental edge in the debate about regulating firearms. In an era of falling crime rates, liberal enthusiasm for gun control simply doesn’t pack much political punch outside certain blue-state environments. Yes, people get riled up, understandably, by mass shootings at schools or movie theaters. Over and over, we’ve seen those emotions fade quickly, giving way to a more sustained counter-reaction from the pro-gun side. The NRA has skillfully responded to calls for stricter gun control by portraying them as evidence that liberals’ real agenda is confiscating firearms-all firearms.

A cadre of highly motivated, well organized pro-gun voters believe the NRA scare tactics and rally behind ever-more-aggressive measures to expand gun rights. Thus, we now have concealed-carry laws in all 50 states. We have traditional self-defense laws replaced by stand-your-ground-and in Georgia, guns everywhere. Even those who deplore these developments at some point must acknowledge the pattern. At present (and maybe always), the intensity of pro-gun passion exceeds that of anti-gun passion.

3. Skeptics of expansive gun rights need to respond intelligently. The smart response is not scorn or exaggeration. For better or worse, gun ownership has come to symbolize a range of deeply felt ideas about culture and government authority. Making fun of people who view their firearms as emblems of liberty and traditional values (however they define those values) will neither change minds nor repeal legislation.

Exaggerating the practical effects of gun-rights legislation doesn’t make sense, either. The Georgia measure allows guns in bars and churches under certain circumstances. Saloon owners who don’t want weapons in their establishments would have to post a sign saying so. That doesn’t sound so onerous; a lot of bars in pro-gun precincts already have such signs. Worshipers in Georgia wouldn’t be allowed to pack heat unless their congregation affirmatively votes to “opt in” to the guns-everywhere law. Personally, I wouldn’t choose a synagogue whose congregants thought they needed Glocks to celebrate the sabbath. But that’s me. If someone else’s congregation feels safer knowing that people are armed, I say: Let them go with God. I doubt that enactment of Georgia’s law will lead to a rash of shoot-outs. If it does, Georgians can reassess.

4. The best response to gun-rights extremism is a focus on fighting crime.
Rather than engage with the NRA on the cultural battlefield, where gun-rights advocates have the upper hand, liberals should focus on the most-pressing problem related to firearms-that their prevalence in American society makes our violent crime more lethal. Broadly speaking, this approach would have liberals emphasize more aggressive enforcement of existing laws against illegal gun possession, rather than obsess about situations that allow law-abiding citizens to own guns and carry them on their person. Still speaking broadly, the anti-crime approach would have liberals ask how the extraordinary successes in reducing violent crime in places like New York-where gun control laws have not changed for decades-can be replicated elsewhere.
 

Brandi

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Aug 13, 2012
Messages
2,663
Reaction score
9
Location
OKC
Well written!

I don't see mixing alcohol and guns as being even remotely a good idea. As for churches if it's good with the church then why not? Many churches these days are focusing on security due to increasing levels of violence in, on and near church property. I did a quick Google on church violence and was surprised to read that it was that common. If some nutcase decides to go postal in a church full of people I'd be tickled pink to have armed folks in the pews.
 

Rod Snell

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Aug 10, 2006
Messages
2,557
Reaction score
363
Location
Altus
I liked it better when KY regulated who could drink in bars, NOT who could go in. When I was 19 and working, I would go to Heine and Tyler's for the best lunch sandwiches in town. I could not stand at the bar, and I could not order or consume alcohol---and they meant it!!
 

nofearfactor

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Mar 24, 2007
Messages
7,265
Reaction score
291
Location
cold, dark
Alcohol and firearms are not a good mix at all, and guns in bars on patrons is definitely no good.

As a bar/music venue co-owner for the last 15 years in Iowa and California I do carry in any of our clubs but only when I am there doing business which is usually during the day when the place is closed. If I come by with it on me during business hours (always via the back entrance) its just in and back out quickly stopping by to pick up cash to take to the bank if the place is packed, but never when Im there playing music or there as just a patron listening to a friends band and might be drinking a beer or three.

I know for a fact that people are carrying in our establishments- whether theyre legal to or not (meaning Im pretty sure we get more felons carrying than CC holders, hard rock types of bars tend to attract a pretty weird crowd). If our staff suspects a person is carrying something they are pulled aside and pat down, in or out of the place. Our door guys (several of which are and have been off duty law enforcement) do not pat down people on a regular basis during the week during slower business but on Friday and Saturday nights when we have multi band bills and we are packed they will pick out certain people in the crowd here and there that look a little suspicious to check out a lil further. If we checked everyone out though it would take hours to get them in there. Weekends we do all ages shows, usually from 7-10, so the kiddies can come in and rock out too, and then after 10 its 21 and up only with the same bands but the bar is open. The 2nd period is usually our wildest crowd because theyre drinking so our guys are on higher alert then but we still monitor the younger crowd pretty tight.

I only remember one major problem with a firearm the entire time I have been involved in the places I am involved in, and that time it was just an unhappy husband who had got kicked out for hitting his wife in the club and he came back with a shotgun and shot at people in the parking lot (including me- I got hit in my left elbow while dragging one of my employees who was shot several times out of the way to my truck to drive him to the hospital).

I remember an old biker bar we used to go to on the weekends in northern California way back in the day. The big burly door man always asked me if I had a knife and or a gun on me- I would always say no because no I didnt have a gun on me (a knife, usually, always)- and he would always say the same thing, " Ah, thats too bad, o well, better watch out then cause more than half of these fckers in here will have one or both".
 
Last edited:

Sanford

Sharpshooter
Special Hen
Joined
Feb 4, 2013
Messages
3,703
Reaction score
298
Location
40 Miles S. of Nowhere, OK.
I remember an old biker bar we used to go to on the weekends in northern California way back in the day. The big burly door man always asked me if I had a knife and or a gun on me- I would always say no because no I didnt have a gun on me (a knife, usually, always)- and he would always say the same thing, " Ah, thats too bad, o well, better watch out then cause more than half of these fckers in here will have one or both".
Reminds me of the old Saddle Club in Chickasha...
"Got any guns or knives on you?"
"Nope."
"Want one?"
 

tRidiot

Perpetually dissatisfied
Special Hen
Joined
Oct 23, 2009
Messages
19,521
Reaction score
12,715
Location
Bartlesville
Eh.... the bar thing I don't care too much about, I don't usually go to bars, and I also agree mixing ETOH and guns isn't usually a good idea. Personally, I feel comfortable enough at my home having a drink or say out camping or BBQing with friends having a couple of beers while I'm still carrying, but not something I'm going to do out in public or I think is appropriate in that venue. I can't imagine being out camping or at a BBQ and saying, "Hang on guys, let me go unload my gun and lock it away before I have a beer, I might not be responsible enough to carry it anymore if I don't." Stupid.

As for guns in churches, I have never, ever, ever understood the prohibition. I mean, seriously...? In Arkansas it is illegal (or was last time I checked, I think that was up to possibly change), but in OK it is just like any other place, as it should be. Personally, if a place of worship bans firearms, I will find somewhere else to go. That's just me... churches are and will continue to be a high-risk place and have been targeted as good zones for killing people. I don't always carry for one reason or another, but I don't want the right taken away from me. Schools I feel the same about, but for the most part, don't have a choice. My son goes to a private school, and I am attempting to get in touch with the principal to discuss the issue of picking him up after school, etc. Public schools are obviously (and stupidly) a no-no. :(
 

NikatKimber

Sharpshooter
Staff Member
Special Hen Moderator
Joined
Jan 2, 2006
Messages
20,793
Reaction score
1,520
Location
Claremore
As we have discussed on this forum before: where is the line dividing a bar that serves food, and a restaurant that serves alcohol?

If I go to Chili's to drink, I should be under the same rules as if I go to a bar to drink. Like a car, I shouldn't matter where I drink, just that there are things you can't legally do *while* intoxicated.
 

Dave70968

In Remembrance 2024
Special Hen
Joined
Aug 17, 2010
Messages
6,676
Reaction score
4,620
Location
Norman
...
I only remember one major problem with a firearm the entire time I have been involved in the places I am involved in, and that time it was just an unhappy husband who had got kicked out for hitting his wife in the club and he came back with a shotgun and shot at people in the parking lot (including me- I got hit in my left elbow while dragging one of my employees who was shot several times out of the way to my truck to drive him to the hospital).
...
So, in fifteen years as a bar owner, you've only seen one incident, and that was someone who had already formed felonious intent and brought his (long) gun along...and that was in the parking lot, not inside.

I say again: if lawful carry in bars is such a problem, please provide examples. Absent evidence, it's just more anti-speak.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom