No guns signs at Hillcrest in Tulsa

[kevin brown]

If you carry your gun wright and it's concealed how would they even know when you have it ??
Me working in a Hospital can only ask you to leave and take your gun out of the Hospital and leave it in your car if we know that your carrying a weapon!!
I carry all the time and if I know where I'm going that day I carry something if it's in a ankle carry, in the pocket, in a belly band this works great if it's carried up high under arm instead of low carry. Or just on my hip. But anyway if you carry some place the owners don't want you to and your gun get taken away by a bad guy and used on others it's your ass that has to pay the price.

 

[Dukester]

Refusing to leave when asked is one definition of trespass as defined by law, but it is not the only definition.

The first definition of trespass in the Tulsa statute reads as follows:


The business owner does not give you consent to be in their building while in possession of a firearm. Without consent, this is trespass.

How am I adding my own words to this?

Because the trespass law is talking about whether you are allowed to be there or not, not what you carry with you.

 

[hrdware]

Because the trespass law is talking about whether you are allowed to be there or not, not what you carry with you.

Right. And do you think the owner still gives you consent to be there carrying a firearm even though they have put up a sign asking you not to?

 

[Dukester]

Right. And do you think the owner still gives you consent to be there carrying a firearm even though they have put up a sign asking you not to?

I didn't say that. Clearly you're drinking your own kool aid and will never get it so keep on keepin on, brutha

 

[hrdware]

I didn't say that. Clearly you're drinking your own kool aid and will never get it so keep on keepin on, brutha

So explain how it is not trespass if you are there without the owners consent.

 

[Dukester]

So explain how it is not trespass if you are there without the owners consent.

Yeah,....that last statement was me ending our little debate due to a lack of desire on my part to interact with you further due to your inability to see the simple thing I was saying. Guess you didn't pick up on that. Enjoy the rest of the thread, I'm outta here.

 

[tulsamal]

Since I had an earlier thread where I talked about No Guns signs... I decided to add onto the existing thread rather than starting another one.

I had posted earlier about how my local Vinita bank, First National Bank, had changed their policy after open carry became legal. We have three banks in town. Back in 1999 when I moved here, I went around looking for a local bank. The other two banks both had "No Guns" signs. Which annoyed the crap out of me. I refuse to walk by that sign over and over and over again and getting angry about it every time. So I opened my account at FNB _because_ they didn't have such signs.

When I walked into the bank back in Nov 2012, I was very disappointed to see the signs had gone up. I asked to talk to the manager. We talked about it but there was "nothing she could do." She told me to ignore the signs if I carried concealed. "Her husband had a CCW and carried all the time." I tried to politely explain that the signs made me feel like a second class citizen. Or as a potential criminal. She said she was sorry and she would pass my concerns on up the line but she couldn't take them down. I told her I would give them some time but sooner or later it would drive me away.

So yesterday I was in town and stopped by the bank with some farm cash to deposit. I walked in, saw the signs. Ground my teeth. Pulled my money out and started filling out a deposit sheet. Still grinding my teeth and thinking about complaining again. But then I decided there are more than enough things in my life that annoy me. No need to subject myself to this. So I went up to the teller with my cash in my hand and told her that I had changed my mind. I didn't want to make a deposit. I wanted to close my account. And I told her why. I got the "oh my" look. She pointed out who I needed to talk to about it.

Went to the other desk. She filled out the forms. She asked me why I was closing my account. I pointed out the signs and told her how I had complained already. She wrote it down and had me sign it. Then she went and got my money.

When I told my wife, she asked me if there was a bank in Vinita that didn't have that sign. I told her no. Got the questioning look. I told her that sometimes you have to stand up for what you believe in, even if it isn't convenient. And I wasn't going to continue banking there just because "it's the only one." They made their choice, I made mine.

My family has other bank accounts. Including online banks. It's just nice to have a local bank when you want to drop some cash into an account or cash a small local check. I'll live!

Good to vent!!

Gregg

 

[tomthebaker]

Ironic, since Hillcrest most likely kills more patients through accidents and secondary infections than guns in the vicinity.

 

[Cinaet]

They have always had your basic gun buster sign on the doors. The handgun picture with the slash across it. And I've always ignored it. But yesterday I noticed the signs were much larger and had a lot of printing.

It seems straightforward to me. They don't want people carrying guns in their hospital. Don't go there if you don't like their policy.

 

[tulsamal]

It seems straightforward to me. They don't want people carrying guns in their hospital. Don't go there if you don't like their policy.

It doesn't "seem straightforward" to me. Hospitals aren't Taco Bell or some BBQ place. If every hospital has such signs... where do you suggest we go for health care? I have health insurance, my son has a serious chronic medical condition, his Doctor works at Hillcrest. It is the hospital where my insurance tells me to go. Etc. I could try praying him well... but let's suppose that doesn't work.

I really think hospitals are one of those areas where this whole "private property, they set the rules thing" falls apart. Hillcrest and St. Johns aren't owned by some single rich guy that doesn't like guns. They are Tulsa's public hospitals. Most insurance in the area sends you there. I'm not a lawyer and I don't even play one on TV... but this seems to me to be a possible legal situation. These facilities that are used by the public and absolutely necessary for their health shouldn't be able to put up signs threatening their customer base for exercising their legal rights. If they don't like the fact that hospitals aren't a restricted area under OK law, then they try to change that. If the law changes and I can't carry there, I will go along with it. But if the law says its not a restricted area (just like my bank) then I'm going to be very unhappy if they put up such signs. But with my bank.... I could close my account and go elsewhere. That's really not an option with health care.

Gregg