Please read if you buy or sell firearms on OKshooters

[Glocktogo]

Good info.

i wouldnt want to unknowingly sell to a criminal. Cant you just ask the guy if he is a felon? Thats usually what i do. if he lies am i still liable?

No. You have no viable way to verify whether a person is a convicted felon.

 

[jstevens]

No. You have no viable way to verify whether a person is a convicted felon.

You do have a way. I provided several links to check. The main point of this is to keep weapons out of felons hands. We have seen a larger than usual number of felons with firearms this year, and the number of gun related crimes with felons is getting crazy.

 

[inactive]

By your own admission, your links only reflect Oklahoma records. We have no way of checking court records instantly for all venues, which I believe is what Glocktogo is addressing.

The larger question is: What constitutes Due Diligence on the part of the seller? How far need they go to ensure they are selling to a party who is able to legally obtain a firearm?

 

[Glocktogo]

By your own admission, your links only reflect Oklahoma records. We have no way of checking court records instantly for all venues, which I believe is what Glocktogo is addressing.
The larger question is: What constitutes Due Diligence on the part of the seller? How far need they go to ensure they are selling to a party who is able to legally obtain a firearm?

Exactly. Checking OSCN is only a partial attempt at verification. Also, in most ftf firearms transactions the seller does not have the full legal name of the buyer until they meet ftf. Until NICS, NCIC or some other entity opens their database to anyone who calls to verify a name, there is no EFFECTIVE way to verify that a potential buyer is or is not a felon.

 

[SMS]

You do have a way. I provided several links to check. The main point of this is to keep weapons out of felons hands. We have seen a larger than usual number of felons with firearms this year, and the number of gun related crimes with felons is getting crazy.

Just curious, do you have any verifiable stats to go with those assertions or is this your general impression based off your particular piece of the puzzle?

For my part, anymore I only sell to people I know personally, or folks who are at at least well established and known here on OSA.

 

[Billybob]

Liability has been mentioned, not to say that isn't important but what about responsibility and conscience?

Worst case scenario;
You meet and sell someone your SKS,(example) then days later your watching the news and see a report about a shooting where a child has been killed, then they show a picture of the shooter and you recognize him as the person you sold the SKS to, anyone want to live with that.

 

[gillman7]

Good info except for one point. An SKS is NOT an assualt rifle.

Thank you!!! My first thought also!!! Kind of tells you the mindset of the OP

Good info.

i wouldnt want to unknowingly sell to a criminal. Cant you just ask the guy if he is a felon? Thats usually what i do. if he lies am i still liable?

You are not responsible to guarantee felony status. Short of NICS, you can't. No one wants to sell to a criminal, if you feel reservations, don't do it.

You do have a way. I provided several links to check. The main point of this is to keep weapons out of felons hands. We have seen a larger than usual number of felons with firearms this year, and the number of gun related crimes with felons is getting crazy.

Got to ask for stats on this generalized statement as well. How long have you been a LEO? To me this goes back to taking personal info down on private sales. I will prove my residency, by showing you a DL or my CCL, will not allow you to copy anything down, or sign a bill of sale. Not a felon, but if I wanted all that paper trails and BS, I would buy it new.

The point that always seems to get overlooked is it is a tool. If I sold someone an ax and they murdered someone with it, I would hate it, but I would not feel responsible. I have no way of seeing the future and knowing what they are going to do with it.

 

[jstevens]

Wow you guys are killing me. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the SKS was produced as a combat rifle, not a hunting rifle. I will admit my knowledge on ak and SKS type rifles is limited. I do know that my vest needs to be at least a level 3, and if a turd starts shooting at me with an SKS I'm gonna say he is assaulting me. What ever you guys want to call it.

I don't have stats yet. As slow as we go they won't be available for at least 2 years. I can say I have recovered more firearms this year, the first 4 months, than I have over the last 2 years.

Look my intent was to share some easy ways you can check to see if someone is a felon. It is against the law to sell a firearm to a felon. Would you be arrested if you do? Probably not, but why take a chance. As far as selling to people out of state, well this is called Oklahoma shooters. I think the majority of members live in Oklahoma. I may be wrong.

Nice avatar gillman7.

Thank you!!! My first thought also!!! Kind of tells you the mindset of the OP



You are not responsible to guarantee felony status. Short of NICS, you can't. No one wants to sell to a criminal, if you feel reservations, don't do it.



Got to ask for stats on this generalized statement as well. How long have you been a LEO? To me this goes back to taking personal info down on private sales. I will prove my residency, by showing you a DL or my CCL, will not allow you to copy anything down, or sign a bill of sale. Not a felon, but if I wanted all that paper trails and BS, I would buy it new.

The point that always seems to get overlooked is it is a tool. If I sold someone an ax and they murdered someone with it, I would hate it, but I would not feel responsible. I have no way of seeing the future and knowing what they are going to do with it.

 

[natgas]

Thanks for the information and links; as an FFL, I do not make any sales without the routine NICS but I think many on our forums can benefit from this information

 

[SMS]

Look my intent was to share some easy ways you can check to see if someone is a felon. It is against the law to sell a firearm to a felon. Would you be arrested if you do? Probably not, but why take a chance. As far as selling to people out of state, well this is called Oklahoma shooters. I think the majority of members live in Oklahoma. I may be wrong.

Good intent...and good advice. We just have a tendency to make threads expand or evolve beyond the original point sometimes.