Religious Topics and Questions

[inactive]

Speaking of the lake of fire, a wise man once said l'enfer, c'est les autres.

And I believe it is accurate. I don't believe that there is necessarily a lake of fire, physical and literal brimstone as described in the Bible or Divine Comedy for that matter. But I think that the choices we make and actions we engage in while on this plane determine where we're "sent" when we leave the living. I believe that once we're in the company of those similar in faith to us, we will eternally live out a life of grandeur and abundance, or a life of suffering, accordingly.

This is sharing my personal interpretations, which is borderline dogmatic I know, but figured I would throw it out there.

 

[MaddSkillz]

I haven't read all the posts yet, but I think you are over thinking this. If you were drowning and someone offered a hand to "save" you who do you think is doing the saving? You, saving yourself by taking the hand or the one offering the hand? We cannot save ourselves. God saved us through Jesus Christ. Yes, we can chose to be saved or not, but salvation is something we cannot do on our own. We can take the hand or we can drown.

So then you agree that the plan for salvation was not complete on the cross and that when Jesus said "it is finished," He really didn't mean it because it all depended on future people and their decisions whether to accept or reject this plan for salvation so in other words it really wasn't finished because it's really only really finished when a person makes a decision to believe or not.

Add to that that the Bible seems pretty clear that belief does not come from us but from God. It really disproves the "free will" doctrine pretty well.

Hmmmm

 

[Leemaxx]

So then you agree that the plan for salvation was not complete on the cross and that when Jesus said "it is finished," He really didn't mean it because it all depended on future people and their decisions whether to accept or reject this plan for salvation so in other words it really wasn't finished because it's really only really finished when a person makes a decision to believe or not.

Add to that that the Bible seems pretty clear that belief does not come from us but from God. It really disproves the "free will" doctrine pretty well.

Hmmmm

No, Christ is the plan for salvation. There is no other way but through Jesus. So "free will" is still there.

 

[MaddSkillz]

No, Christ is the plan for salvation. There is no other way but through Jesus. So "free will" is still there.

Ephesians 1:11
In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who works all things after the counsel of his own will:

I don't see "free will" anywhere in the bible. This verse seems especially clear to me about it.

Oh and here's another verse.

Daniel 4:35
And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?

 

[Rob72]

Ephesians 1:11
In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who works all things after the counsel of his own will:

I don't see "free will" anywhere in the bible. This verse seems especially clear to me about it.

Oh and here's another verse.

Daniel 4:35
And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?

"....unto all things there is a season..." You're selecting select verses to support your position. There are things that will happen. The way we encounter and travel through those events is determined by our relationship with God. Two people experience the same event. One turns bitter, unforgiving, malicious, and vengeful. The other becomes forgiving, merciful and empathetic. This is the nature of free will, and it meshes perfectly with Erickson's Stages of Development.

Primary choices (may) have more impact on our decisional processes than we think. I.e., unless you agressively seek God(make a definite choice), your genetics may have resulted in a "retarded" spiritualist experience. Couple that with maladaptive (criminalistic) nurturing from birth, and you may well not be "called". The theory of generational sin would support this position.

Please note, as far as accuracy, the Hebrew Bible (previously linked) is as close as you can get to original interpretation, unless you speak archaeic Hebrew and Aramaic Greek.

 

[VIKING]

Sounds ok to me. May prove to be interesting.

It has proved to be more than just interesting. I've set here and read every post and even though I may be fired for not working it has been very, very interesting to read the many different views..Thanks to everyone for your post and for keeping it clean..To you Maddskillz, thank you very much for bring up a topic that a lot of people would not dare..Everyone have a wonderful afternoon..Viking

 

[MaddSkillz]

"....unto all things there is a season..." You're selecting select verses to support your position. There are things that will happen. The way we encounter and travel through those events is determined by our relationship with God. Two people experience the same event. One turns bitter, unforgiving, malicious, and vengeful. The other becomes forgiving, merciful and empathetic. This is the nature of free will, and it meshes perfectly with Erickson's Stages of Development.

Primary choices (may) have more impact on our decisional processes than we think. I.e., unless you agressively seek God(make a definite choice), your genetics may have resulted in a "retarded" spiritualist experience. Couple that with maladaptive (criminalistic) nurturing from birth, and you may well not be "called". The theory of generational sin would support this position.

Please note, as far as accuracy, the Hebrew Bible (previously linked) is as close as you can get to original interpretation, unless you speak archaeic Hebrew and Aramaic Greek.

So then you believe salvation, based on belief is not an equal opportunity, opportunity.

 

[MaddSkillz]

"....unto all things there is a season..." You're selecting select verses to support your position. There are things that will happen. The way we encounter and travel through those events is determined by our relationship with God. Two people experience the same event. One turns bitter, unforgiving, malicious, and vengeful. The other becomes forgiving, merciful and empathetic. This is the nature of free will, and it meshes perfectly with Erickson's Stages of Development.

Primary choices (may) have more impact on our decisional processes than we think. I.e., unless you agressively seek God(make a definite choice), your genetics may have resulted in a "retarded" spiritualist experience. Couple that with maladaptive (criminalistic) nurturing from birth, and you may well not be "called". The theory of generational sin would support this position.

Please note, as far as accuracy, the Hebrew Bible (previously linked) is as close as you can get to original interpretation, unless you speak archaeic Hebrew and Aramaic Greek.

If the Bible is so clear about free will, it should be easy to post a verse instead of stating I'm posting verses out of context... Wouldn't it?

 

[SlammerG_89]

People who are afraid to examine their beliefs with a critical eye are losers and fools. This applies to religious and political beliefs. A person who blindly accepts dogma can never grow. They are nothing more than intellectual parrots.

I feel the same way JB. When i questioned things both religiously and politically years back is when i truly started to learn. And like it was fore mentioned John 14:6 - Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

 

[rhodesbe]

People who are afraid to examine their beliefs with a critical eye are losers and fools. This applies to religious and political beliefs. A person who blindly accepts dogma can never grow. They are nothing more than intellectual parrots.

But; A person without faith is self-righteous.