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shtf milsurps

Discussion in 'Military Surplus' started by ronny, May 20, 2012.

  1. rhodesbe

    rhodesbe Sharpshooter

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    I've never been in combat, shot a gun at anyone (dead or alive), and doubt that 'my opinion' should even be considered in the same stratification as a combat vet.

    However, this story seeths of bunk. The stories about the vain 'stopping power' of the 30 Carbine never seemed to be common until after Korea, when hypervelocity 223 ballistics became 'en vogue'. I'm sure you've heard them too... tales about a squad of GI carbiners emptying mag after mag into a N. Korean, capturing him unscathed after a footchase, and witnessing a bunch of 30 slugs falling out when then when they unfurl his frozen, but perforated, bedroll.

    Time after time, the skeptics eventually are proven the 110gr ball slug has plenty of energy at effective range. I simply cannot believe that a human being could absorbs 15 rounds of a 30 caliber projectile and still be among us. That's crazy talk. It's far more believeable that he missed 15 times, rather than the Korean kept charging, oblivious to his wounds.

    Consider the 30 carbine has greater velocity and energy @ 100 yards and even @ 200 yards than the vaunted .45 ACP has at the muzzle:

    [​IMG]

    The 30 carbine was responsible for downing tens of thousands of frenzied, banzai enraptured Japanese solders, yet no one questioned it's value at a time when it's effectiveness was under incredible scrutiny.
     
  2. HackerF15E

    HackerF15E Sharpshooter

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    There is lots of real world data that debunks the "frozen heavy clothing" myth.

    Example:
    http://theboxotruth.com/docs/bot36.htm

    Inaccurate shooting by the holder of the M1 carbine is a more likely answer.
     
  3. flatwins

    flatwins Sharpshooter

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    I've toyed with the idea of a Camp 9 a few times but, as you say, the price of them has gone up. Could have picked one up at a show a couple years back for prob $325. I like 9mm carbines but don't currently own one. When I do get another it will be a Keltec Sub2000.
     
  4. ronny

    ronny Sharpshooter

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    rhodesbe, I tend to agree with your thinking. I place this in the same category as the "M1 clip ping". However, since Shadowrider indicated a Korean War vet flat out stated it happened to him, I just let it go. What do I know. On the other hand, I've seen Chinese quilted uniform stuff and it's not Kevlar.

    When I was a kid, I shot at a coyote that jumped up in front of me at about 10 yards. I missed; or his coat was too thick.

    Having said all that, I would have much rather had an Garand in the same set of circumstances; or in any set of circumstances.
     
  5. ronny

    ronny Sharpshooter

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    Well, I bought that Camp 9; pretty pleased with it. It's all in pieces now. The only issue with it is a less than pristine stock. I'm stripping it now and will refinish it.

    Lucky me, it's got a brand new recoil buffer in it, so I won't have to mess with that. I think I will put a stronger recoil spring in it since I will probably shoot a few +P's in it.

    Pretty good truck gun.
     
  6. flatwins

    flatwins Sharpshooter

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    Very cool! IIRC Choate makes (or made) a cool folding stock for them. Does it take S&W 59 mags?
     
  7. ripnbst

    ripnbst Sharpshooter

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    You can build an AR 15 for around $500 nowadays. does that count as a mil sur?
     
  8. ronny

    ronny Sharpshooter

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    Yeah, supposedly any 59 series mag will work. I hope so. The only thing I've found wrong with it is, I think, the original mag won't operate the Bolt Hold Open mechanism. At least not manually. As I sit here and mess with it, I begin to think I see the problem and that it'll work when firing.

    I love to mess with old guns.
     
  9. henschman

    henschman Sharpshooter

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    I'd say M1 Garand. I dispute the notion that they are not cheap. $500 got me a great shooter from the CMP (field grade). I've had Nagants, I've had SKSes, I've had M1 Carbines, and they are OK... but I can just flat out HIT with the M1. You can get the ammo for $.50/round, and it is reloadable. If you really wanted to go SHTF style with one, you could go with a lighter Ramline synthetic stock, an Ultimak scout mount, and an Aimpoint co-witnessed with the irons. Sure there are cheaper options, but bang for your buck, you can't beat a CMP M1.

    Another nice option for a nice lighter-weight meat getter that could work for 2-legged critters too would be a scout rifle built on one of the common mil-surp bolt guns. I am partial to the FR-8 Spanish Mauser myself... 7.62x51, decent adjustable aperture sights, stripper clip guide, 18" barrel, flash hider, and a scout mount sits low enough to co-witness a red dot or mount a scout scope low enough not to need a cheek riser. Set one up like that with a lighter-weight synthetic stock, and you have a winner.
     
  10. whetrock

    whetrock Guest

    The old 91/30 Mosin Nagants are IMO pretty serviceable old war horses. Given their inexpensive price and the availibility of common reasonably priced surplus ammo they're cheap enough to were an average person can buy several and a decent cache of ammo so in the event of civil unrest they can arm friends or neighbors as well as have back up rifles for themselves. Not just real accurate rifles by any means but very much so minute of badguy out to a few hundred yards in the right hands. With soft point ammo they can also make decent medium to large sized game hunting rifles as well. I'd see them as decent bartering/trading currency in the event of an economic colapse as well similar to the "trade musket" of times past.
     

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