SWAT guns down US Marine in home

[338Shooter]

I can't fault the officers for shooting, but the people who ordered the warrant served in such a manner and the people who denied the man medical attention for however long have some explaining to do.

 

[gsarg]

Point to consider: SWAT knew his work schedule, and the schedule of his wife and kids. Why not detain him when he's leaving work, and execute the warrant on the house simultaneously? Most likely, the same goal is accomplished without having to fire a single shot, and nobody has to die (citizens or police)

 

[MaddSkillz]

Point to consider: SWAT knew his work schedule, and the schedule of his wife and kids. Why not detain him when he's leaving work, and execute the warrant on the house simultaneously? Most likely, the same goal is accomplished without having to fire a single shot, and nobody has to die (citizens or police)

Those were my sentiments in post #20 of this thread. We don't know the answer yet.

 

[carleb]

Like anyone else here I suppose, I have no idea who will end up on the right side of this thing. Concerning "no knock" entries though, I don't lay awake at night worrying about it much, but I have given thought to the question: If one were exercised at my home, would I transition from thinking in a life and death defensive position, to recognizing LE, to dropping my defensive weapon fast enough to keep from being shot? I don't know. That would be a tight spot.

Other than the cordial, respectful, occasional traffic stop, I've never had any form of confrontation with LE and certainly hope it stays that way. I tend to believe that "no knock" should be used in only the gravest extreme, or with totally overwhelming evidence. Evidence where someone is willing to bet their career on it.

 

[penismightier]

Point to consider: SWAT knew his work schedule, and the schedule of his wife and kids. Why not detain him when he's leaving work, and execute the warrant on the house simultaneously? Most likely, the same goal is accomplished without having to fire a single shot, and nobody has to die (citizens or police)

They do not always have this information.

 

[HMFIC]

Yes the facts will come out and the public will find out what truly happened.
"He didn't get medical attention for one hour".....He had 71 holes in him...the man was dead right there no medical attention warranted.

It seems like all OSA is becoming lately is a forum for people to bash cops and complain about laws and law enforcement practices.

While you're looking at the "facts":

It was not reported that he had 71 holes in him, it was reported that 71 shots were fired.

You say he was "dead right there"... even though his wife reported that he was still alive and asking for help (see link below)


I still have a lot of trouble reconciling the fact that he was denied medical attention. I just don't get that at all.

http://www.kgun9.com/story/14629829/medical-care-blocked-for-man-killed-by-swat?clienttype=printable

His wife Vanessa was hiding in the closet with their 4-year-old son during the shooting. When she emerged, she saw her husband on the floor in a pool of blood, but still alive. Vanessa told KGUN9 she called 911 and pleaded with deputies to treat his wounds.

"The only thing I told them was take care of him, take him to a hospital," she said.

KGUN9 News requested the emergency call records for Drexel Heights Fire Rescue. The 911 call center notified Drexel Heights at 9:43 a.m. A unit arrived just two minutes later at 9:45. However, deputies told rescue workers to stay put. That's standard to be sure they won't walk into a dangerous situation. But paramedics waited until 10:59 a.m. Then they heard the radio call "Code 900", which meant they were no longer needed because the person was dead.

After one hour and 14 minutes, Drexel Heights indicated they were never allowed to even examine Jose .

Also, it was said earlier in the thread that anyone taking as many rounds as he did from 7 yards wouldn't have survived anyway...

I personally know of two young women who took 8 and 9 rounds of 9mm each to the chest at around the same distance and survived with prompt medical attention. No matter that, why on earth wouldn't he get medical attention anyway to determine if they could have saved him?

 

[LightningCrash]

Does anyone know that he was SHOT sixty times and not shot AT?

That is a question I have as well. Earlier we hear 71 shots fired, now someone is claiming he was struck 60 times. With no indication of the number of active shooters or what they were shooting, it's hard to see if 60 hits would be likely or even prudent. Who is producing the numbers we're hearing, and did they say anything else?
The sealed records might mean a dearth of information for a while.

Typically the ME's report on shootings won't even claim a certain number of hits and is left to the investigative agency or speculation based upon the ME report due to the damage projectiles sometimes create.

The reports I have seen point out entry and exit wounds although those are frequently duplications i.e. a single bullet striking two limbs and the torso.

I believe that any tabulation of the number of stikes in this incident is nothing but unbridled speculation.

Either way, I have read enough of your posts over the years to know that you are an intelligent individual; Intelligent enough to know that your post is simply inflammatory and not legitimate discussion.

Post according to the recommendations earlier in this thread if you desire to continue here.

Michael Brown

I guess I would have to read more ME reports to get further acquainted with their style. In the case of the Ersland shooting with Antwun Parker the wounds are enumerated very well by the ME, though there were no instances where the projectile passed through an appendage before entering the torso. The report reads very straightforward.

I have complied fully with your earlier recommendations. The question wasn't pointed to be inflammatory. I actually looked up cycle rates for common subguns and police M4s to see how long of a trigger pull that would be (assuming they were running FA). The number just didn't seem likely.

 

[MaddSkillz]

They do not always have this information.

I could get this information pretty easily.

EDIT: Okay, maybe not "easily" but I think think you could trail the guy from his house. And with the resources the PD have, I don't see why they may even need to do that.

 

[338Shooter]

They do CPR/epi/atropine on dead people for up to two hours sometimes in the hospital before the code is called.

 

[LightningCrash]

They do not always have this information.

It's also possible that they wanted to apprehend people in the commission of a crime.

Is a copy of the warrant available anywhere?