If everything is "all the same".... which is complete B.S..... then why do many that tout this theory, "hate" different calibers so much? I never got that. They should all be the same to you.
I don't hate any caliber, hate is an emotion I reserve for living beings.
I do, however, have absolutely no need or respect for calibers that offer nothing over above that which is established. The .40 is a perfect example of this. It offers a smaller projectile than a .45, with less capacity than a 9mm, and no increased ability over either.
As for the "all the same BS," I stand by that comment. All three of the major autopistol rounds are basically indistinguishable insofar as to their lethality. With modern hollwpoint ammo, each of them is as effective and inneffective as the next. This is not opinion, or conjecture, but simple truth.
If you buy a 45gap, make sure you get a very low price on the pistol and don't buy a bunch of extra stuff for it. Resale is not good on anything associated with 45gap and it will only get worse in the future IMHO.
The no need, I understand, the no respect? Dunno about that. I'd wager you wouldn't step in front of a .45 GAP.
It might be a SIMPLE truth in your opinion for sure. However, there is no PRJ data showing your claims of them being indistinguishable, rather all the "data" out there isn't good enough to make your assumptions. There isn't a critical period to where velocity does damage and then it does not. Hence it would be a gradual curve. Certain rounds/loads DO in fact act differently through various human tissues, which is something ballistic gel cannot account for.
Scientific theory and exterior ballistics say one thing, while empirical data gleaned from actual uses of force say something completely different. I tend to side with what has actually taken place, rather than what should happen, based on the numbers.
Shootings that have occurred using hollowpoint ammo of modern design reflect my previous statements. The human body is a complex, yet glaringly simple, mechanism. Take away the electrics or the hydraulics, and it ceases to function. Any modern hollowpoint with sufficient penetration will perform this function as good as the next, when its put in the right place.
A larger caliber, increased capacity, or faster bullet is nothing but a security blanket, an excuse to like what you like.
Shootings that have occurred using hollowpoint ammo of modern design reflect my previous statements. The human body is a complex, yet glaringly simple, mechanism. Take away the electrics or the hydraulics, and it ceases to function. Any modern hollowpoint with sufficient penetration will perform this function as good as the next, when its put in the right place.
A larger caliber, increased capacity, or faster bullet is nothing but a security blanket, an excuse to like what you like.
Me too. I'm not talking about predicitve theory. It's a fact that the human body is made of various tissues that vary in consistency. The physics of certain rounds will vary, and therefore the results will vary. The "everything is equal" crowd cannot account for the human variable but stay true in their assumptions. Their theory either relies upon ballistic gel OR street reports. There's too many variables for one to intelligently say one way or another when it comes to "street" reports because the data collection isn't done in a consistent manner.
Well with the sufficient penetration, you're on to something. However, in the real world some rounds/loads glance off, don't penetrate, don't expand etc etc. Proof positive they aren't all the same.
I wouldn't call it a security blanket. However, if one belives a rifle performs better, they'd be a hypocrite to not want more velocity or sectional density in their handgun platforms.
Like I said, there's not a critical period of a certain FPS or weight where a round peforms/doesn't perform. Back to why you hate the GAP? I still don't get it.... if they are all the same? in your opinon.... why would you care what rounds/platforms are developed?
Again, everything is all the same(supposedly to them), so why do people care so much that others want a .45 in a .40 sized frame?
Apparently, others dont, or they wouldn't be discontinuing them.
I have seen many examples of "modern hollow points" NOT EXPANDING!! And to be fair I have seen plenty that have...so I guess what Lilly's is saying is "IF" they all happen to expand they are about equal in performance.
"IF" they don't expand there is a very great difference in performance, with historical and empirical data giving the heavier bigger bullets quite an edge, so I guess it depends on if you want to bet that the bullets you have, are all going to expand or not. I like to plan for the "not" and will be greatly pleased if they do!
More to the point of this thread 45 G.A.P. isn't taking of because of a few things, not much in the way of cheap ammo for practice, capacity of the gun it's-self, and lack of a cheap supply of Brass for reloading, although it is starting to have a bit of following in the revolver competitions, cause they are shorter than a regular 45 and just a tiny bit faster to reload with full moon clips.
"IF" they don't expand there is a very great difference in performance, with historical and empirical data giving the heavier bigger bullets quite an edge, so I guess it depends on if you want to bet that the bullets you have, are all going to expand or not. I like to plan for the "not" and will be greatly pleased if they do!
More to the point of this thread 45 G.A.P. isn't taking of because of a few things, not much in the way of cheap ammo for practice, capacity of the gun it's-self, and lack of a cheap supply of Brass for reloading, although it is starting to have a bit of following in the revolver competitions, cause they are shorter than a regular 45 and just a tiny bit faster to reload with full moon clips.
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