Your thoughts

[Fatboy Joe]

A friend of mine stopped about midnight in Tulsa to get a drink from Quik Trip. He parked on the side of the building. When he returned to his truck, two men were breaking into his truck. They ended up stealing everything and robbing him.

Here is the question, if you walked up and noticed two men breaking into your truck is that a valid self defense situation? I thought I would post here instead of the self defense forum because well more people read this area.

 

[Glock 'em down]

Short answer: No.

Long answer: Hell no.

In Oklahoma, we used to be able to defend property as well as ourselves. Not anymore. Now all you can defend is yourself and your loved ones if you feel like your life is in immediate and certain danger. If you even saw somebody in the Wal-Mart parking lot, you are not suppossed to intervene. Just call 911 and get a good description of the assailants.

Now then...what would I really do? I think everybody here knows the answer to that because it's the same thing on their minds as well.

 

[Lurker66]

Just my thoughts and feelings, You have every right to defend yourself, your family and your property.

If im ever a juror, thats how i will see it.

 

[Johnny]

If we could only pick our own jury. We need 11 more just like you Lurker.

 

[reddog1]

When they proceeded to come twords you, (instead of fleeing the scene)

2 guys getting out of MY car to come rob me? I would be in fear of my life. Period.

 

[NikatKimber]

I didn't think it was illegal to intervene, just not justifiable cause for deadly force?

 

[ez bake]

These are the scenarios that everyone who carries a weapon for self-defense should think about... a lot.

It's not justifiable to use lethal force if you see someone breaking into your car - so you can't go jumping into a situation like that guns-ablazing. There is, however, nothing wrong with shouting at the thieves to "get away from my car" because at that point you don't know that they're armed or mean you any harm.

It's also highly advisable to call 911 on your cell-phone if you have time (you always want to be the one who called 911 - never the guy that someone else called 911 and identified as "a shooter").

This could end several ways and you have to be prepared for all of the possible outcomes.

Here's a few:

1. If they take off running, you cannot pursue if you're carrying a weapon... No matter what your adrenalin or instincts tell you, pursuing is no longer defending your life and if you have a loaded handgun with you, you're now looking to punish someone for their crimes (or start a fight - one that you now have a very unfair advantage in). Neither of those actions are covered by the law.

2. If they come at you... well, now you're faced with a situation that is uncertain. They might mean you physical harm, and they might just mean to rob you without harming you, but not knowing, I would draw my weapon and start yelling to get back or something like that. If they don't, then it's time to defend yourself in my view. If they do retreat then - again, you cannot pursue (especially if you have your gun drawn). You don't want to for your own protection (nearby police do not automatically know who the good guys are from the bad guys and an adrenalin-pumped guy chasing someone with a gun is rarely a sign that he's the good guy). Even if the police are nowhere around, once you begin pursuing the bad-guys, you just stepped outside the coverage of Stand-your-ground/Castle-Doctrine and you're playing with fire in an attempt to be a vigilante (go ahead and count the media, the prosecutor, and district attorney against you - they do not want vigilantes running around a city and for good reason).

3. What if they just keep on robbing your truck and ignore your request for them to leave? That's probably the toughest scenario of all. You can't shoot people for stealing your stuff if your life isn't in danger (the punishment for theft is not death in any state in the US), and if you draw and try to intimidate them into leaving your vehicle alone, you're now in a funny legal-territory because two wrongs don't make a right (again, you just stepped outside the protection of Stand-your-ground/Castle laws because nobody's life wasn't in immediate danger).

In this case, I'd probably just stand by and call 911. I've got no stuff that's worth loosing my life over and I'm not trained to detain someone like the police are. Sure, citizens can make an arrest, but we're not legally authorized to do so at gunpoint and most aren't trained to detain someone properly (and look at how difficult it is for police to do so when a suspect is resisting - that often leads to lawsuits, so you can guess that it wouldn't end well for a non-LEO citizen).

Use your head - we've got enough hot-headed blow-hards with their CCW permit (that are looking to use their gun as an extension of their ego) out there. Those aren't "the good guys" in my opinion. Don't get me wrong - in a high-stress situation it's easy to screw up and most of us will likely do so, but to go headlong into a situation with little or no training and proceed to run on adrenalin or anger is a recipe for disaster.

Just be careful. There are plenty of stories in the news about something like this going good or bad for the CCW'er. Look at the details of the cases and learn from past mistakes.

 

[GlockCop]

Heres something to add to the above scenario...what if you keep a gun in your car? I would think that if they have found it/find it your life is certainly in danger. Just a thought that you should keep it secure if your going to leave it in your car.

 

[Glocktogo]

As a LEO, I'd effect an arrest, using only that force which is necessary to do so.

 

[HMFIC]

This is why I always carry a baseball bat with me when I leave my vehicle.

You just never know when a couple 'o nice fellas might want to strike up a game in the parking lot.