Anyone register a pistol brace?

[Chuckie]

I wasn't talking about any of that other ****. I was talking about braces which had the full "blessing" of the ATF... Until they didn't. You guys can use those big broad brushes, I'll just be in my bunk while you do.

Like most things, the gun community screwed themselves by trying to circumnavigate the laws. I'm not talking about whether a member of the gun community thinks the laws are 'right', whether the ATF has the power to make a law, whether the ATF has the power to enforce it, whether anyone believes that their Constitutional 'Rights' have been violated, whether 'Ginger' or Mary Anne' is the better pick, or any other tangent that people ALWAYS like to shoot off on.
What I'm talking about is the arm-brace that was designed for and approved for use by those with a disability, to allow them to be able to shoot a shorter barreled (and lighter) weapon accurately and safely.
And just like with the Bump-stock, which was produced and marketed as a work-a-round to existing gun laws that prohibited the possession and use of non-registered 'machine guns', the arm-brace was seen as a way to work-a-round the existing laws that prohibited ownership and use of unregistered SBR's.
Now, after a few 'screwed the pooch' and got caught, everyone is up in arms (no pun intended) about having their 'right' to have an unregistered arm-brace violated, which was never their 'right' in the first place. Not only did they screw themselves, they also screwed every disabled shooter that needed that arm-brace in order to safely enjoy the shooting sports.
Blame the ATF, blame Congress, blame the sitting President (as usual), but the only ones that really deserve the blame are those that tried to circumnavigate the laws by breaking them.

 

[Shadowrider]

Like most things, the gun community screwed themselves by trying to circumnavigate the laws. I'm not talking about whether a member of the gun community thinks the laws are 'right', whether the ATF has the power to make a law, whether the ATF has the power to enforce it, whether anyone believes that their Constitutional 'Rights' have been violated, whether 'Ginger' or Mary Anne' is the better pick, or any other tangent that people ALWAYS like to shoot off on.
What I'm talking about is the arm-brace that was designed for and approved for use by those with a disability, to allow them to be able to shoot a shorter barreled (and lighter) weapon accurately and safely.
And just like with the Bump-stock, which was produced and marketed as a work-a-round to existing gun laws that prohibited the possession and use of non-registered 'machine guns', the arm-brace was seen as a way to work-a-round the existing laws that prohibited ownership and use of unregistered SBR's.
Now, after a few 'screwed the pooch' and got caught, everyone is up in arms (no pun intended) about having their 'right' to have an unregistered arm-brace violated, which was never their 'right' in the first place. Not only did they screw themselves, they also screwed every disabled shooter that needed that arm-brace in order to safely enjoy the shooting sports.
Blame the ATF, blame Congress, blame the sitting President (as usual), but the only ones that really deserve the blame are those that tried to circumnavigate the laws by breaking them.

Again. You aren't stating the full story and only what supports your position and throw other minutia in to support you being wrong.

The gun community didn't circumnavigate anything. Yes, the ATF acknowledged that the brace was designed for the disabled. What you are apparently purposefully leaving out is that ATF also said that using the brace in a different manner didn't constitute a design change, and they specifically state the the firearm would NOT be subject to NFA. Here's a letter. If you would just google search "pistol brace atf letter" and select images you'll see pages and pages of them. OK I'm out, y'all have fun throwing around disinformation about the gun community...

 

[1shott]

Bwahahaha - the 'Left' had nothing to do with this 'arguing amongst ourselves' thing. Everyone on the 'Right' has a personal opinion that God himself wouldn't be able to change . . . and that's the problem . . . everyone absolutely refuses to bend even a little, even if it was for the good of the whole. NOPE!-will die before I change my ideas, NOPE!-everyone's an idiot except me, NOPE!-it's his fault, it's her fault, it's their fault . . .

As I said right where the left wants us. Fighting amongst ourselves

 

[Letfreedomring]

 

[Chuckie]

Again. You aren't stating the full story and only what supports your position and throw other minutia in to support you being wrong.

The gun community didn't circumnavigate anything. Yes, the ATF acknowledged that the brace was designed for the disabled. What you are apparently purposefully leaving out is that ATF also said that using the brace in a different manner didn't constitute a design change, and they specifically state the the firearm would NOT be subject to NFA. Here's a letter. If you would just google search "pistol brace atf letter" and select images you'll see pages and pages of them. OK I'm out, y'all have fun throwing around disinformation about the gun community...

View attachment 382736

- The original idea and approval by the ATF of the arm-braced rifle (which also out of necessity had a shorter barrel so as to be lighter for one-arm use) was so that paraplegics could safely enjoy the shooting sports, and was also exempt from NFA required SBR registration.
- Some members of the gun community however, latched onto the idea that by slapping an arm-brace onto their SBR's, they would no longer need to be registered under NFA guidelines as a SBR, as long as they claimed that it was being used strictly as an arm-braced firearm.
- Then the gun accessory people stepped-in to provide all manner of modified and 'extended' arm-braces that could also be shoulder-braced/fired.
- The ATF came back a couple of times with guidelines trying to clean-up misconceptions about true arm-braced weapons designed for handicap use vs SBR's with 'faux' arm-braced/shoulder-braced setups attached that claimed to be for arm-braced use only.
- And every time the ATF came back with newer guidelines to address those 'technically illegal' work-a-rounds, the gun parts industry came back with ever newer work-a-rounds to again circumnavigate the laws about required SBR registration.
-I would not be surprised if ALL arm-braces are eventually banned, same as was done with Bump-stocks, simply because some in the gun community [again] refused to abide by ATF regulations.

 

[Beautiful Mulberry]

The original idea and approval by the ATF of the arm-braced short-barreled rifle was so that the disabled could safely enjoy the shooting sports by using a shorter, lighter firearm, with just one arm.
Some members of the gun community latched onto the idea that by slapping an arm-brace onto their SBR's, they would no longer need to be registered under NFA guidelines as a SBR, as long as they used it strictly as an arm-braced firearm.
Then the gun accessory people stepped-in to provide all manner of 'extended' arm-braces that could also be shoulder-braced/fired.
The ATF came back a couple of times with guidelines trying to clean-up misconceptions about true arm-braced weapons vs SBR's with 'faux' arm-braced/shoulder-braced setups.
I would not be at all surprised if ALL arm-braces are eventually banned, like they did with Bump-stocks, because of a few decided to circumnavigate the rules which ruined it for everyone!

The government also sensors us when is does not like what we have to say. So should we start practicing to be either politically correct or start restricting our own freedom of speech? Because it sounds like the government is going to start doing it for us if we don’t start policing everyone within our community. I mean after all there’s a few of them going to ruin it for us all…

 

[Perplexed]

like they did with Bump-stocks, because of a few decided to circumnavigate the rules which ruined it for everyone!

Two Federal courts this year have decided against the ATF‘s rule on bump stocks, citing the rule of lenity in their decision that the ATF’s classification of bump stocks as machine guns was ambiguous. With all the flip-flopping the ATF did with arm braces, and the three (3) preliminary injunctions already in place against the ATF’s enforcement of the arm brace rule, we can expect more slapping down of the ATF. After all, if they can play fast and loose with their vague rules, why can’t the American public do the same?

 

[Chuckie]

The government also sensors us when is does not like what we have to say. So should we start practicing to be either politically correct or start restricting our own freedom of speech? Because it sounds like the government is going to start doing it for us if we don’t start policing everyone within our community. I mean after all there’s a few of them going to ruin it for us all…

I hate the idea of .gov stepping-in because everyone knows that when they do it just turns into a major 'fluster-cluck' and it's us that always ends up getting the shaft. But that's how our country and the government rolls these days, and if we don't police ourselves to their satisfaction . . . they will (and do) step-in. Then it just another little piece of Freedom gone forever.

 

[Chuckie]

Two Federal courts this year have decided against the ATF‘s rule on bump stocks, citing the rule of lenity in their decision that the ATF’s classification of bump stocks as machine guns was ambiguous. With all the flip-flopping the ATF did with arm braces, and the three (3) preliminary injunctions already in place against the ATF’s enforcement of the arm brace rule, we can expect more slapping down of the ATF. After all, if they can play fast and loose with their vague rules, why can’t the American public do the same?

OK, so if the Federal courts slapped down ATF rules on Bump-stocks, then why isn't the market flooded with them? Why aren't gun accessory manufacturers pumping them out to the retailer? Obviously being slapped down by Federal court(s) didn't do a damn thing, did it, so the rules still apparently stand!
As far as the public playing 'fast and loose with vague rules' like the .gov, or the affluent, or the privileged, or the 'connected', or the celebrity? We both know how that works.

 

[Beautiful Mulberry]

OK, so if the Federal courts slapped down ATF rules on Bump-stocks, then why isn't the market flooded with them? Why aren't gun accessory manufacturers pumping them out to the retailer? Obviously being slapped down by Federal court(s) didn't do a damn thing, did it, so the rules still apparently stand!
As far as the public playing 'fast and loose with vague rules' like the .gov, or the affluent, or the privileged, or the 'connected', or the celebrity? We both know how that works.

I honestly believe the government is scared of its ppl. They can or have made these rules, yet they have never came or tried to take the what they outlawed. Many states, L.E.O have also vowed to not enforce it. They understand what mass compliance means. If they TRY to come and take them, they know they WILL have a war on their hands. They know this.