"For Our White Friends Desiring to Be Allies"

[D. Hargrove]

Was waiting for our friends of Native American heritage to expound on the promises of the US Government and their broken promises and treaties. See the Gov't has a history of telling us what we want to hear and then doing something else entirely, although there may be just a bit of our promise included for them to say, what? I will not trust the health care of myself or beloved family members to anyone except me. I will pay for their care, my retirement benefits will pay for mine and should they require treatment, it will be provided for because it will be paid for accordingly. I have Health insurance on my family of 6 kids the wife and I, I pay that happily as I KNOW they will receive the best treatment available should they need it. I have lived in Germany for 8 years and watched the health care system work there, I have a brother who lives in Canada and is married to a Canadian, they have 4 kids and the system there is broken as well. In fact, a simple thing like getting your tonsils out had a wait and they brought the child to Detroit to have her tonsils removed. No system if perfect, but ya get what you pay for in my mind.

 

[Rooster1971]

I can't tell if this post is a joke or if this is serious...

Are you getting at that US healthcare isn't excessively expensive, or the insurance companies don't beat you out of treatment like the government would.

If it's the former, latter or both, can I borrow your rose colored glasses?

 

[JD8]

Nope, it's clearly outlined exactly how in the single-payer proposals that I and others have linked here on OSA (although mine were in other threads, on the same topic).

Ah.... soo pixie dust and unicorn farts it is.

 

[YukonGlocker]

Ah.... soo pixie dust and unicorn farts it is.

Many, although not all, of the links/evidence you're requesting (e.g., how to pay for x program, how will y work, there is no evidence that z will change anything, etc.), I've posted in this thread: https://www.okshooters.com/threads/sooner-or-later-single-payer-is-coming.246692/. There have been other discussions as well. I don't really see any value in continuing to post the same stuff again and again, but it's there if you want it.

 

[operator742]

There is no need my friend, I for one know what I believe and why I believe it,and am not naive enough to believe in fairytales.

As D. Hargrove stated he has seen the effects first hand of socialist medicine, and it's failures. It is amazing to the arrogance here in America, that even though socialism has failed in every country that has tried it ,there are those here that are naive enough to believe we can make it work.

 

[dennishoddy]

I think some here are getting the wrong idea of Medicare, so let me clue those people to reality.

Those of us on Medicare pay for Part B out of our Social Security retirement benefits. Medicare Part A is hospitalization and is free, but in order to be able to go to the doctor's office, one needs Part B. If a doctor treats one in a hospital, then I suspect that his bill must be paid by Part B. In addition to paying from our Social Security for Part B, if we want a supplement, than we also get to pay for that as well. With a supplement, I can be treated just about anywhere. Before we came to Oregon, I had signed up for a Medicare Advantage plan, which was a mistake because with Medicare Advantage, I had no coverage here in Oregon. It would have only been good in Colorado.

So, "Medicare for all" is a misnomer.

In addition, for those so enamored with Obumbacare, it wasn't good for my wife. When we retired, she wasn't 65 (and still isn't yet,) so no Medicare for her. Looking into the O-care exchanges, the best she could find was a plan that required her to pay $250 per month ($3000 per year) and then have a $10,000 deductible. So, she would have had to have paid $13,000 before O-care did anything for her. Not having the health issues that could have reached that number, she chose to "self-pay" and pay the O-care penalty. Fortunately, we were advised of a good source of discounts for medications called GoodRX.com, which does quite well financially for most prescriptions. We also found that some health care providers give a good discount for those paying outright.

Edit:

Medicare part B only pays retirees 80% of medical treatment by a doctor. We also have to buy a supplement on the open market to make up that 20%.
As far as single payer and the government taking care of our medical needs, and anybody falsely believing they can, remember these famous words, "you can keep your Doctor, you can keep your plan. This will save the averageAmerican family $2400.00 per year."
Husain Obama POTUS

ABSOLUTE HORSE$HIT!
Obamacare was predesigned to fail so single payer would have to be adopted and shoved down our collective throats by the government dong.

 

[tRidiot]

I'll just give my personal opinion based fairly extensive experience that if you provide "free" universal healthcare (a misnomer, to be sure) and you think it's going to make a major difference in American healthcare from a preventative standpoint, I think you're sadly wrong. I wish that were true, but it just isn't.

<edit> And to add, I have actually lived and worked in a socialized system, as well. While it does have its good points, just like our system, it has plenty of failures as well, and I can assure you the failures I observed would cause barnburnings from Americans who have been conditioned to expect the best of everything at all times without any financial consequences.

 

[YukonGlocker]

I'll just give my personal opinion based fairly extensive experience that if you provide "free" universal healthcare (a misnomer, to be sure) and you think it's going to make a major difference in American healthcare from a preventative standpoint, I think you're sadly wrong. I wish that were true, but it just isn't.

I agree. First, nobody presenting single-payer plans are claiming they are free...in fact, the funding programs are clearly laid out. Second, switching to single-payer, alone, won't do much to change our focus to preventative...that could happen, however difficult it may be, regardless if we go to single-payer, or not; but it would require larger changes in values and priorities at the cultural level.

 

[tRidiot]

but it would require larger changes in values and priorities at the cultural level.

1000% this.

America needs an enema.

I've said for a long time, this country could do with some hardship. Not that I'm wishing bad on anyone, don't get it twisted. I'm not calling for wars or race wars or famine or any of those things - but hardship is something that has and could pull us together as a nation and help swing people's values back toward what is really important in life - instead of which Kardashian is naked now, or what politician is schtuping whom.

 

[YukonGlocker]

1000% this.

America needs an enema.

I've said for a long time, this country could do with some hardship. Not that I'm wishing bad on anyone, don't get it twisted. I'm not calling for wars or race wars or famine or any of those things - but hardship is something that has and could pull us together as a nation and help swing people's values back toward what is really important in life - instead of which Kardashian is naked now, or what politician is schtuping whom.

Yes, we call that a 'superordinate goal'. Those are typically effective short-term, but not long-term. At this point, short-term would be better than no term!