Larry Vickers roasts AR-15.com!

[sigsilly]

Neither Larry Vickers or a AR15.com spongebob fan are bullet proof.
As the old saying goes, Colonel Colt made them equal.

 

[rlt7272]

That said, my personal experience has been that those who spend a great deal of time critiquing over the internet do not have much to say in person.

Michael Brown

I think we can all agree that this is true.

 

[WhiteyMacD]

I think we can all agree that this is true.

Thats not neccessarily true. If you pull something douchey, and you put it out there for people to see, I'm going to call a spade a spade. And if and when you ask me in person, I wont hesitate to call you a douche for what you did. I dont understand this "dont have much to say in person" thinking. My question is, what will anyone do if you express your opinion to your face? Whoop your butt? There multiple reasons why that isnt a good response to criticism; Legality, Liability and further degredation of reputation are to name a few...

Calling LAV a douche does not discredit his skill or worth as an instructor. My reasons for calling him a douche is not because of his skills or professional experience. Nor does it have to do with his opinion on ARFCOM. Its the fact that he is hocking a product by slamming a community. Now I realize that it is possible that most of what he said might have been scripted by a marketing department, but its still a douchey move.

Im sure most of the instructors on OSA would say we have some armchair/.net commandos on this forum, but if any of them were to come out and single out OSA as a place for .net commandos, I know I would quickly lose respect for them, even if they werent talking about the 80% that suffer from oral defecation.

My point being, I know plenty instructors who have just as much shooting skills that dont use "slam" techniques to profess their superiority in a sport/hobby/whatever you want to label it.

 

[okgirl]

Awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!! LAV is the MAN!!!!!!

Im sure the gear qu*)* over at Barf.com really are tyiping away...
Hope they "get it" some day and start training its WAY more fun than typing..

Says the person typing..

 

[FAL guy]

I thought it was pretty spot on.

Me too. I hate that place.

 

[Glocktogo]

Thats not neccessarily true. If you pull something douchey, and you put it out there for people to see, I'm going to call a spade a spade. And if and when you ask me in person, I wont hesitate to call you a douche for what you did. I dont understand this "dont have much to say in person" thinking. My question is, what will anyone do if you express your opinion to your face? Whoop your butt? There multiple reasons why that isnt a good response to criticism; Legality, Liability and further degredation of reputation are to name a few...

Calling LAV a douche does not discredit his skill or worth as an instructor. My reasons for calling him a douche is not because of his skills or professional experience. Nor does it have to do with his opinion on ARFCOM. Its the fact that he is hocking a product by slamming a community. Now I realize that it is possible that most of what he said might have been scripted by a marketing department, but its still a douchey move.

Im sure most of the instructors on OSA would say we have some armchair/.net commandos on this forum, but if any of them were to come out and single out OSA as a place for .net commandos, I know I would quickly lose respect for them, even if they werent talking about the 80% that suffer from oral defecation.

My point being, I know plenty instructors who have just as much shooting skills that dont use "slam" techniques to profess their superiority in a sport/hobby/whatever you want to label it.

I would say that many instructors teach sport/hobby shooters and that would be the way to go.

LAV teaches people who do it for a living, whose lives depend on the instruction he imparts. If you want to attend a LAV or similar class and you don't do it for a living, you'd better be ready to walk the walk and talk the talk or they're likely going to send you packing. They consider the lives of their students who are serious practicioners over the almighty dollar. That their students walk away from serious encounters alive is their stock in trade.

I'd consider Super Dave Harrington to be an egotistical showman, but I'd never have the gall to go up to him and debate his choice of gear or tactics.

I'm not defending the marketing strategy of DD here, just pointing out that their view of the AR market they most want to serve is slightly different than your average hobbyist.

 

[HiredHand]

Larry is certainly opinionated and arrogant but he's no douche.

However those traits are epidemic in the Special Operations community, which is high testosterone. Some folks just can't survive in that environment and there's nothing wrong with that as long as you recognize those folks for who they are and give them a wide berth.

Folks may not like him, but he's no douche.

Douche implies a large quantity of cowardice which is best exemplified by those who will not confront others in any manner other than from behind a keyboard.

That certainly does NOT include Larry Vickers who has fought bravely against some of this country's most viscious enemies and is no punk.

It's really only worth calling someone a douche if you'll do it to their face and calling someone who has manned up the way Larry Vickers has a douche smacks of unwillingness to put yourself on the line the way he has.

Michael Brown[/QUOTE

+1 for great post

Douchey, douche, and douche bag must be the comments of the week here. It's seems like I every thread I've read here lately somebody is throwing one of those terms out.

 

[bettingpython]

I would say that many instructors teach sport/hobby shooters and that would be the way to go.

LAV teaches people who do it for a living, whose lives depend on the instruction he imparts. If you want to attend a LAV or similar class and you don't do it for a living, you'd better be ready to walk the walk and talk the talk or they're likely going to send you packing. They consider the lives of their students who are serious practicioners over the almighty dollar. That their students walk away from serious encounters alive is their stock in trade.

I'd consider Super Dave Harrington to be an egotistical showman, but I'd never have the gall to go up to him and debate his choice of gear or tactics.

I'm not defending the marketing strategy of DD here, just pointing out that their view of the AR market they most want to serve is slightly different than your average hobbyist.

I will agree with Jerry on this one, as welcome as non LEO plane jane civvies are in TDSA classes the fact of the matter is that they are geared for the guy who does it for a living.

It was a different experience for me having never been in Law Enforcement or the Military but I was prepared to be behind the curve when I took his carbine 1 class. It was a real eye opener and even though they didn't act like douche's as some have said of Larry Vickers the fact of the matter was if you are the sensitive type then training with the big boys is probably not what you want to do.

I learned alot about what does and does not work, actually made some changes to my AR platform 1/2 way through the first day because I will tell you though it looked good but it was flat out wrong, and the TDSA instructors have no problem telling you it's wrong in just about the same minimum of words, were they being douches? No but they were trying to get me to the same level as some really serious shooters in that class had I been a sandy vagina sort of fellow I probably would have whined about the way I was treated.

LAV is making a point he is not trying to impress the keyboard jockey's he has developed a weapons platform combination that works and he is trying to sell it the pro's.

 

[WhiteyMacD]

I would say that many instructors teach sport/hobby shooters and that would be the way to go.

LAV teaches people who do it for a living, whose lives depend on the instruction he imparts. If you want to attend a LAV or similar class and you don't do it for a living, you'd better be ready to walk the walk and talk the talk or they're likely going to send you packing. They consider the lives of their students who are serious practicioners over the almighty dollar. That their students walk away from serious encounters alive is their stock in trade.

I'd consider Super Dave Harrington to be an egotistical showman, but I'd never have the gall to go up to him and debate his choice of gear or tactics.

I'm not defending the marketing strategy of DD here, just pointing out that their view of the AR market they most want to serve is slightly different than your average hobbyist.

I know what his instruction forte is. And that is exactly my point. If you are targeting professionals, why attack a group that is predominantly hobbyists?

Douchey, douche, and douche bag must be the comments of the week here. It's seems like I every thread I've read here lately somebody is throwing one of those terms out.

Maybe because the synonyms for the word douche are slightly more offensive?

 

[RETOKSQUID]

Larry is certainly opinionated and arrogant but he's no douche.

However those traits are epidemic in the Special Operations community, which is high testosterone. Some folks just can't survive in that environment and there's nothing wrong with that as long as you recognize those folks for who they are and give them a wide berth.

Folks may not like him, but he's no douche.

Douche implies a large quantity of cowardice which is best exemplified by those who will not confront others in any manner other than from behind a keyboard.

That certainly does NOT include Larry Vickers who has fought bravely against some of this country's most viscious enemies and is no punk.

It's really only worth calling someone a douche if you'll do it to their face and calling someone who has manned up the way Larry Vickers has a douche smacks of unwillingness to put yourself on the line the way he has.

Michael Brown

Funny, most of the "professionals" in the military I have ever met or worked with in the past were quite down to earth, somewhat on the quite individual side and far from being egotistical. It was always the ones who were the opposite, that ended up washing out in the end.

As far as being a punk, no he is not a coward, and he absolutely has some killer combat skills.

But IMNSHO, he still acts like a self absorbed douche.