Proposed Regulation Changes for ODWC

[AllOut]

Fishfurlife....
That's just it, they hold out for 160+ AND kill them consistently. I'm not talking about just with a rifle either, these are guys I bow hunt around and they will pass up a 150 with a bow. One decided he was going to move it up to 170, he killed a buck early muzzleloader and was very upset that it only went 168.
How many in OK can make claims like that. If they do then they eat tag soup a lot.

But to everyone.... Like I keep saying, I'm not all for ARs I'm just using them as an example of what can be used. BUT name one other way that can almost guarantee our 1.5 yo buck harvest drops considerably. Which will also help us balance out the sex ratio, less bucks killed so maybe guy will start filling their freezers with doe instead of spikes. I would rather not see one, heck I would be fine if everything stayed the way it is. But how are we going to get people to kill doe and stop shooting immature bucks without some type Of restrictions?

 

[dennishoddy]

A solution for trophy hunters already exists. DMAP. I've seen first hand how well the DMAP program works. If trophies is what you are after, get a group together, get at least the min amount of land and participate in the DMAP program. I hunted for 5 years on a ranch that participated in the program and it worked great.

There is no need to impose sweeping unnecessary regulation changes that impact those who don't wish to participate.

I've been on a DMAP for 8 years now. Your correct, it works.

 

[dennishoddy]

Most of you guys would lynch me if I got to set the regs up the way I would like to see them.

I pass on a lot of good bucks every year, but I'm against ANY trophy managment practices. Its a personal decision to take an animals life. Some want trophy's, some want/need meat.
They don't have the time/resourses/or location to hold out for deer and take the first they see. Folks like that are harvesting food.
I'm talking the people that REALLY need the meat. On our DMAP we take 40 does a year, and its amazing how many people really want/need a deer for the table. The GW in the county will know of family's that are in need as well as some of the processors have a list of folks that want a deer. I shoot two a year for a lady in OKC that cannot eat beef, pork, or chicken bought from a store. She can eat venison.
Our DMAP does go to the needy, and senior folks that can't get out any more.
Antler managment practices lead to higher leases, more land closed to hunters getting permission as land is leased for big antlers. It will quickly morph into texas style hunting.

As far as doe management, I've said before, make it a rule to take a doe before being allowed to buy a buck tag.
This also opens up another can of worms, as the take a doe before a buck program, means they will shoot the first slick head they see, including button bucks.
Button bucks are shot pretty regularly anyway as inexperienced hunters don't know how to recognize them. Hell, even experienced hunters get one on occasion.

 

[264Magnum]

As far as doe management, I've said before, make it a rule to take a doe before being allowed to buy a buck tag.
This also opens up another can of worms, as the take a doe before a buck program, means they will shoot the first slick head they see, including button bucks.
Button bucks are shot pretty regularly anyway as inexperienced hunters don't know how to recognize them. Hell, even experienced hunters get one on occasion.

So if you can't get a buck tag unless you shoot a doe first, what happens to the people who hunt in the panhandle where you can't shoot does?

 

[dennishoddy]

So if you can't get a buck tag unless you shoot a doe first, what happens to the people who hunt in the panhandle where you can't shoot does?

Regulated by zone like we do now.
If the buck to doe ratio is square, then its open season. Nothing different that has been done in the past.

 

[30BulletHoles]

Turning state law into trophy management practices would be a mistake. What is good for one person may not be for another. Bottom line, get out and hunt, enjoy it, take someone new to hunting, take kids hunting, take a girl hunting, shoot deer for meat, shoot the best buck that have seen walk in front of you no matter what it scores, eat what you kill, donate meat to those who need it, be proud of everything you kill and proud to be a hunter.

Don't buy into all of the "huntin show" product placement, outfitter advertising, only the "well heeled" can play, high dollar, gotta kill a big buck or stay home ********.

GET OUT AND HUNT

 

[fishfurlife]

Turning state law into trophy management practices would be a mistake. What is good for one person may not be for another. Bottom line, get out and hunt, enjoy it, take someone new to hunting, take kids hunting, take a girl hunting, shoot deer for meat, shoot the best buck that have seen walk in front of you no matter what it scores, eat what you kill, donate meat to those who need it, be proud of everything you kill and proud to be a hunter.

This is exactly what I am trying to convey here. The majority speaks every time the wildlife department surveys and the surveys have always said that Trophy management comes in second. Yes I would support a reduction of buck tags, but I also know that this is not what would suit the bulk majority of hunters in Ok.

AllOut - I feel that once a person gets to the point of being dissatisfied with a 168" buck, then they have most likely lost focus on hunting itself. This is my own opinion and only that. As for saving the 1.5 year class with a AR, all you are doing is letting those deer get a year older and then you are whipping out the 2.5 year age class. The bulk majority of Okie hunters just want to shoot a buck. They don't care what size, the surveys have proven this. So they are going to shoot the first legal buck they see. Be it a legal fork or an 8 point that meets the AR rules.

Oklahoma has a deer herd that varies in sex ration. I can tell you that it would be extremely rare right now to find a large area that had a 30:1 doe to buck ratio. Just by talking to Bio's of the WMA's that I hunt I have found that the highest ratio I can find on public land where doe harvest is not even aloud during rifle season is a 9:1 ratio of does to bucks. That is on public land where the buck harvest will outweigh the harvest of bucks on private land any day(when comparing bucks taken per acre). They conduct the same spotlight counts on most WMA's that all the DMAP participants must and I know of at least 4 ranches in this program that are at a 2:1 ratio. Private landowners in Kansas have also become very good at Cooping with their neighbors and watching what they harvest. We have regulations that would let anybody manage for trophies in this state.

 

[AllOut]

Fushfurlife....
I dont think it's a loss of focus on hunting, I think it's more of having a goal set and challenging yourself. What's the challenge in shooting a 1.5-2.5 y/o buck?
You made another interesting statement which is kind of true. Yes "meat hunters" out number the "trophy hunters" in the surveys. But it's typically by a very slim margin every year, usually close enough you might as well just call it 50/50. Then you say that most hunters just want to shoot "a" buck and dont care about the size. Why is that? It's not for meat, otherwise they would be fine with a doe. It's cause they think it's a "trophy"...
So in other words, your meat hunters who just want to shoot any buck are infact just trophy hunters with lower goals or standards. Which is OK, especially with our current deer herd. But if our herd becomes better, and we start seeing larger more mature bucks on a regular basis, do you think those guys would raise their standards and pass a few young bucks just to see what might be next?

As far as Texas, you can't compare us to them. Our hunting life style is nothing like theirs nor is our state really capible of being like them. To them, high fence is just how it is and it's the norm. Most Okies are against it plus the majority of our state us broken up into mile sections. It's kind of hard to fence in 20k acres when you have county roads running through it.

 

[distantfoe]

DMAP obiously works in areas of large properties, but what about the majority of Oklahoma? There's not a lot of large properties in OKlahoma that DMAP would have a chance to work with. There's too many small pieces of property lined with hunters ready to kill the first spike they come across, mixed in with the large DMAP properties.

 

[bigcountryok]

DMAP obiously works in areas of large properties, but what about the majority of Oklahoma? There's not a lot of large properties in OKlahoma that DMAP would have a chance to work with. There's too many small pieces of property lined with hunters ready to kill the first spike they come across, mixed in with the large DMAP properties.

Yes you do have to contend with other hunters on properties that don't participate. I watched a small 7pt three days in a row one time only to have him cross the fence and get shot. It’s just a part of it. I hope the guy that got him was happy and his family enjoyed the meat.

Trophy hunting is not for everyone and should not be forced on everyone. It’s an individual choice. In places with small properties, the best solution is to get the landowners together and have them participate as a group. Explain to them the benefits of the program.

Other than that, you cannot nor should not stop someone from enjoying their hunting traditions and freedoms because you would like a deer with large antlers. It’s a free choice and it should remain that way.