Question about .380 ammo

[HiredHand]

Here are Dr. Gary Roberts thoughts on .380 ACP from the terminal ballistic section on m4carbine.net

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19914

Handguns chambered in .380 ACP are small, compact, and generally easy to carry. Unfortunately, testing has shown that they offer inadequate performance for self-defense and for law enforcement use whether on duty as a back-up weapon or for off duty carry. The terminal performance performance for self-defense and for law enforcement use whether on duty as a back-up weapon or for off duty carry. The terminal performance of .380 ACP JHP's is often erratic, with inadequate penetration and inconsistent expansion being common problems, while .380 ACP FMJ's offer adequate penetration, but no expansion. All of the .380 ACP JHP loads we have tested, including CorBon, Hornady, Federal, Remington, Speer and Winchester exhibited inconsistent, unacceptable terminal performance for law enforcement back-up and off duty self-defense use due to nadequate penetration or inadequate expansion. Stick with FMJ for .380 ACP or better yet, don't use it at all. The use of .380 ACP and smaller inadequate penetration or inadequate expansion. Stick with FMJ for .380 ACP or better yet, don't use it at all. The use of .380 ACP and smaller caliber weapons is really not acceptable for law enforcement use and most savvy agencies prohibit them While both the .380 ACP and .38 sp can obviously be lethal; the .38 sp is more likely to incapacitate an attacker when used in a BUG role. BUG--Infrequently used, but when needed, it must be 100% reliable because of the extreme emergency situation the user is dealing

 

[Remington]

My apologies for getting off the topic of your original question but your statement says as much about your mindset as it does your caliber/projectile choice. Caliber/projectile choice are irrelevant if you don't have the proper mindset in a self-defensive situation.

Being a newbie to a CCW I don't even know what my mindset is yet. I'm trying to learn this as I go. I know my mind is set that I picked a gun that I'm the most likely to carry concealed. After all if you don't carry it you can't use it.

Here are Dr. Gary Roberts thoughts on .380 ACP from the terminal ballistic section on m4carbine.net

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19914

Handguns chambered in .380 ACP ..........

Now that's a reply I can work with. Thanks.

 

[Remington]

One thing to remember is that you will never, even see 12" of penetration in a human being. No where in our bodies do we (well, most of us) have 12 inches of goo, unimpeded by other objects, bone of course being what I am mentioning here.

If I shoot someone in the chest, and immediately the round finds their sternum, I WANT penetration. I want as much force as I can to splinter that bone and get to the vitals underneath. A good hollow point may well have the penetration to get there. Then again, it may not.

But to answer your question, how much penetration do I need? I want as much penetration AND expansion as I can get. Period.

FWIW, I use Fiocchi ball and Speer Gold Dots in my .380. I have numerous rounds of each through the pistol to determine they function well. If I didn't use the Speer, I would likely go with Corbon (non Pow'rBall), after ensuring it runs fine through the pistol.

Good points, good things to keep in mind.

 

[Blitzfike]

When I was a LEO, I had the opportunity to discuss caliber vs stopping power with a local Medical Examiner. I had read all the various theories over the past few decades with big bore vs velocity vs hollow points etc. and had concluded on my own that it is hard to beat the 45acp for self defense. I was surprised to hear him say that he didn't see a lot of difference in weapon choice in the bodies he examined. There were folks shot with mouse guns (.22-.25 cal) who had severe damage internally and others who were shot with magnums and 45acp that were through and through wounds that the damage was minimal. Wound placement was the main criteria in stopping a person in his opinion. I carried a 1911 in 45acp as my primary duty weapon and would again if I was in the field, but I am comfortable with it and have fired many thousands of rounds with it. Today I may carry a 25acp, a 32acp or a 40sw compact, it just depends on where I am going and what I'm wearing. Blitzfike

 

[Phat Mike]

I got some buffalo bore .380+p I use in the kel-tec.. was told not to give it a full time diet of them.. but it's better than a dull stick in the eye IMHO

 

[Dr_Mitch]

There was an article in Rifleman this year about test results from a bunch of .380 sub-comps, and the only one that had no failures was the Rohrbaugh. So, you should really spend some time finding a reliable combination of ammo and gun.

 

[rmwolf]

Just a quick point... Carry a 380 if you wish. I do too on occasion when I cannot conceal anything larger. But fully prepare yourself mentally for followup. That is... empty the mag, create distance (get the heck out), or transition to other SD techniques. A 380 has a greater capacity to buy you some time rather than stop the threat.

 

[ripnbst]

OP said that FMJ has better than 12" penetration. How thick are the BG's in your areas? I run JHP in all my guns. I want a golf ball out the other side. To me that is worse then going through the BG, and my dog, and my couch, my drywall, and stopping in my exterior brick wall.

 

[inactive]

OP said that FMJ has better than 12" penetration. How thick are the BG's in your areas? I run JHP in all my guns. I want a golf ball out the other side. To me that is worse then going through the BG, and my dog, and my couch, my drywall, and stopping in my exterior brick wall.

Just remember that BGs aren't made of only ballistic gel. They wear clothes, have skeletons, etc... all of which can affect the penetration. A .380 FMJ won't over-penetrate more than a 9mm JHP, which get 13-17 inches even when expanded.

 

[jhat]

Follow the suggested break in period with ball ammo (200 rounds I believe for the Kahr 380) then test with defense loads. My Kahr does not like Cor bon 90gr. but loves Cor Bon DPX 80 gr. The pistol also likes Speer Gold Dot and Winchester PDX1 bonded ammo. Be sure to run enough of the defense loads through the gun to check for reliability. I know it is expensive but when ur a.. is on the line you need ammo that will function with the weapon.