the cost of wind power

[RickN]

RickN:
I have a VERY hard time believing that an engineer came up with those numbers. Just one example of gross error is the $1.16 per kilowatt hour price for electricity. If he had actually done his homework, he would have known that the USA average for residential electricity was 13.3 cents at the end of 2020(less than 1/10 the cost he quoted). I also question his assertion that the average house has 100 amp service. Even my relatively small 40 year-old house has 200 amp service. There are other problems with his story, but these two examples should be enough to make me doubt anything else he says.
I am certainly not a fan of electric vehicles, but this guy is not even close to telling it like it is. I own an electric motorcycle, and my son-in-law owns a Tesla. Both of them are for sale. I do have some real world experience with e-vehicles and from my point of view, they are not yet ready for prime time. Charge times are just one problem. Cold weather performance is pretty disappointing. Range between charges does not live up to expectations. Repair costs are insane and owners are not allowed access to information that might allow them to fix anything.

Cost of power I can not attest to, most homes having a 100 am service I can. Unless a home was planned as total electric, most were given a 100 amp service at least until the 80s. You could get a bigger service but you paid extra for it. I know, I use to install them and only stopped in the early 80s.

 

[MacFromOK]

I also heard, "The utilities will buy back all the electricity you produce", referring to wind gen and solar gen system you buy.

I don't think this is true here. Am I wrong?

Some companies do, and all may be required to now (not sure about that).

But be aware... they sell it to you at retail, and they buy it back from you at wholesale. So you'd have to produce a good bit more than you actually use just to break even.

 

[SoonerP226]

Some companies do, and all may be required to now (not sure about that).

But be aware... they sell it to you at retail, and they buy it back from you at wholesale. So you'd have to produce a good bit more than you actually use just to break even.

OEC has two "tiers" for what they call "distributed generation." For systems 300kW and under, they do Net Metering, where the meter can actually run backward as you're generating electricity, so they do sometimes buy at retail rates. If you generate more than you use, they credit it at "avoided energy cost" rates, which apparently comes from Western Farmers Electric Coop. (OEC's FAQ links to a page at WFEC that no longer exists, so I'm not sure what avoided energy cost rates are.)

If your generation is over 300kW (or if your generation regularly exceed 125% of your usage), they install a separate meter and then they do buy at wholesale rates.

 

[TwoForFlinching]

I also heard, "The utilities will buy back all the electricity you produce", referring to wind gen and solar gen system you buy.

I don't think this is true here. Am I wrong?

Some states do, some don't. Some states require a battery array to store your own excess and don't require the electric companies to pay back-power. Others regulate net-metering where the power company only allows offset watt for watt of your usage. Other states allow a free-for-all but like others said, unlimited buy-back is usually at wholesale.

 

[MacFromOK]

OEC has two "tiers" for what they call "distributed generation." For systems 300kW and under, they do Net Metering, where the meter can actually run backward as you're generating electricity, so they do sometimes buy at retail rates. If you generate more than you use, they credit it at "avoided energy cost" rates, which apparently comes from Western Farmers Electric Coop. (OEC's FAQ links to a page at WFEC that no longer exists, so I'm not sure what avoided energy cost rates are.)

If your generation is over 300kW (or if your generation regularly exceed 125% of your usage), they install a separate meter and then they do buy at wholesale rates.

I haven't looked into it since the '90s when I had the farm, and my only personal experience is with RRVREA (our CoOp), but they informed me in no uncertain terms that they would only pay wholesale for anything I put back into the grid. And it would require a separate meter on any wind powered input to the grid.

I'm actually surprised that any company would allow a direct exchange rate, even for small amounts. After all, that markup is where their profit & operating capital comes from (the majority of it anyway).

 

[SoonerP226]

I haven't looked into it since the '90s when I had the farm, and my only personal experience is with RRVREA (our CoOp), but they informed me in no uncertain terms that they would only pay wholesale for anything I put back into the grid. And it would require a separate meter on any wind powered input to the grid.

I'm actually surprised that any company would allow a direct exchange rate, even for small amounts. After all, that markup is where their profit comes from.

I haven't looked to see what OG&E or PSO say about it, but OEC seems to be more customer-focused than most. I'd guess that the "THOU SHALT RENEWABLE ENERGY THE HELL OUT OF THINGS!" mandates from the gov't have pushed them into changes.

 

[Oklahomabassin]

A new style of defroster on this wind turbine north of Calumet on Saturday.

 

[TerryMiller]

RickN:
I have a VERY hard time believing that an engineer came up with those numbers. Just one example of gross error is the $1.16 per kilowatt hour price for electricity. If he had actually done his homework, he would have known that the USA average for residential electricity was 13.3 cents at the end of 2020(less than 1/10 the cost he quoted). I also question his assertion that the average house has 100 amp service. Even my relatively small 40 year-old house has 200 amp service. There are other problems with his story, but these two examples should be enough to make me doubt anything else he says.
I am certainly not a fan of electric vehicles, but this guy is not even close to telling it like it is. I own an electric motorcycle, and my son-in-law owns a Tesla. Both of them are for sale. I do have some real world experience with e-vehicles and from my point of view, they are not yet ready for prime time. Charge times are just one problem. Cold weather performance is pretty disappointing. Range between charges does not live up to expectations. Repair costs are insane and owners are not allowed access to information that might allow them to fix anything.

I wouldn't be so sure about assumptions on building homes. We just purchased a home after looking for about 2 months or so. In our looking, we happened upon a new neighborhood being built. We stopped and looked at things at the model home and then went on down to look at a couple of homes in the process of being built. We were surprised to see walls with studs on 24" centers instead of 16".

We talked with someone later and mentioned that and was told that "supposedly" builders could use 24" centers if they were building with 2 by 6's instead of 2 by 4's. What we saw weren't 2 by 6's. So, if builders are willing to build a house with fewer studs, I wouldn't be surprised if they limited the size of the electrical system.

 

[dennishoddy]

Yep. Here is my before and after. When I bought it, it was located less than a mile from town and was obviously used for target practice. I had to repair over 90 bullet holes. Three months later, it looked almost new.

View attachment 194533 View attachment 194534 View attachment 194535

Nice job on the repairs! Ours have a couple bullet homes in them as well.
Don’t know what the fascination was about shooting windmill blades but most have them.
I guess the idiots that shot them never considered the farm houses down range.

 

[dennishoddy]

Those Aermotor windmills were a boon for agriculture (especially cattle operations) in the past.

But though they worked great for that application, I've heard/read that they were woefully inefficient compared to modern wind power designs.

Nothing beat them for pumping water at the time though.