Warrantless search - Rogers County

[Rez Exelon]

So, That means that there are 659,340 that are not wanting to kill people.

I’ll take those odds.

Sure....I'm sure that'd be a great consolation to the families of people killed without reason.

Note that I'm not a member of the school of thought that there is no such thing as justified use of force. I've watched plenty of videos where perps got 86'd and didn't have an issue with it. I've also watched plenty of videos where in my opinion the LEO got away with murder. I am definitely a member of the school of thought that LEO's shouldn't be in the (hypothetical) .001 in this line of comments.

 

[tweetr]

I like reasoned, objective discussion.

I am not inclined just to let it go because the deputies placed my son's very life in danger. He did not lose his head or his temper, but it would not be unexpected for any young man to do so! In this instance the deputies initiated and escalated a contact that simply had no reason to undertake it in the first place. The citizen going peacably about his business has every right to be left alone by agents of the government. Expressly the Fourth Amendment right.

What would you posit as the reason to have law enforcement officers in a community in the first place?

I propose the only valid moral justification is to prevent and punish violence upon one's person and property. If, however, the very law enforcement officers become the sole cause of violence upon a person and his property that otherwise would not have occurred without the specific efforts of the law enforcement officers, have you not just invalidated the case for having them in the first place?

 

[OK Corgi Rancher]

What would you posit as the reason to have law enforcement officers in a community in the first place?

I propose the only valid moral justification is to prevent and punish violence upon one's person and property. If, however, the very law enforcement officers become the sole cause of violence upon a person and his property that otherwise would not have occurred without the specific efforts of the law enforcement officers, have you not just invalidated the case for having them in the first place?

Cops aren't in the punishment business. That's up to the courts. But you have many of the same freedoms to protect yourself and property that officers do.

I think the rest of your statement is probably accurate, IF it were like that. I don't believe it is. I still say it's the exception and not the rule.

You need look no further than many urban areas that've recently undergone various "defund the police" movements to see that police are generally very beneficial to society. I'd say the evidence is overwhelming.

 

[Snattlerake]

I have not read all the posts. Did your son get a ticket or a warning cite for the tail lights? If he received no paperwork in reference to the initial stop, did he receive any paperwork at all? Copy of a search by officers Tweedle, and Dumm, PC By Deputy Bark? A signed release form from your son stating there was no damage done to his vehicle by the searching officers? Any paperwork at all?

 

[Snattlerake]

What would you posit as the reason to have law enforcement officers in a community in the first place?

I propose the only valid moral justification is to prevent and punish violence upon one's person and property. If, however, the very law enforcement officers become the sole cause of violence upon a person and his property that otherwise would not have occurred without the specific efforts of the law enforcement officers, have you not just invalidated the case for having them in the first place?

There is a state law stating failure to comply is an additional charge so IF YOU ARE EVER STOPPED, GO WITH THE FLOW!

 

[tweetr]

Cops aren't in the punishment business. That's up to the courts. But you have many of the same freedoms to protect yourself and property that officers do.

I think the rest of your statement is probably accurate, IF it were like that. I don't believe it is. I still say it's the exception and not the rule.

You need look no further than many urban areas that've recently undergone various "defund the police" movements to see that police are generally very beneficial to society. I'd say the evidence is overwhelming.

I meant it as a thumbnail sketch. The police officer ultimately collects evidence and brings the accused into the courtroom where he is to be tried and, upon conviction, sentenced to a punishment of some sort. I agree the officer of the court is not the agent of punishment.

 

[Rez Exelon]

This is what it boils down to for me. I get the OP is upset about this and I can understand it. He feels strongly about this and wants this incident to be made right and doesn't want it to occur again. Fair enough.

What I'll never understand, especially with online discussions, is why people have to go full-retard? Why can't people have reasonable, rational discussions free from emotional hyperbole like the "average" cop will shoot someone over a made-up circumstance? And the doubling-down on stupid just goes on from there.

It's nearly impossible these days to have an adult, objective discussion about anything without someone ruining the entire discussion.

I really like the use of the term "full-retard" juxtaposed against the later lament of it being impossible to have "an adult objective discussion".......

 

[tweetr]

I have not read all the posts. Did your son get a ticket or a warning cite for the tail lights? If he received no paperwork in reference to the initial stop, did he receive any paperwork at all? Copy of a search by officers Tweedle, and Dumm, PC By Deputy Bark? A signed release form from your son stating there was no damage done to his vehicle by the searching officers? Any paperwork at all?

No! No citation for the originally stated cause for the stop!

 

[okcBob]

No! No citation for the originally stated cause for the stop!

What? You mean they made up an excuse to pull someone over? What are the odds…

 

[sh00ter]

Not defending the sheriff and his corruption, but this vid says a lot of why we put up with this stuff.

Cop is going out in harms way to make sure all is well, BUT still does the cop thing and talks smack to a dying guy after he's full of holes. I just wasted you but let me say in an authoritarian manner "Do not move!"

I'd be glad to have them there if it was my neighborhood and a bad guy was on the loose, but likely what would happen is I would be the one with the shotgun trying to investigate the bump in the night and they would roll up and cap me. That stuff happens all the time; same in self-defense situations where good guy pulls gun to stop bad guy and cops shoot good guy. Again, trade-off, but I still wanted to share and ask how many people would want to roll up on that scene to a mossberg with a pistol grip pointed at you? So it makes it harder to criticize the police when they do the dirty work that others not willing to do.



Best way in my opinion to get better policing is mandatory mental health testing, mandatory IQ testing, mandatory bill of rights testing (and periodically was well after hired), and highest possible pay. I think if you implemented these things 90% of police corruption and police incidents would resolve. Also, some sort of peer review process implemented to keep them all honest. Private sector does that for employment reviews. I won't hold my breath though.