I'm almost new here, I've been reading posts for a few months. Ok you got me I'm new here. So here is my thought. I have my CCP or what ever you want to call it and I attend college full time. The issue I have is that, according to the school I attend, once I cross some magic line onto the campus I am immediatley an immature punk not capable of making my own decisions much less capable of protecting myself or being responsible enough to carry my weapon. Why does my Second Amendment right stop once I'm on campus? What do you all think should permit holders be able to carry on college campuses?
I support campus carry but there are several reasons underlying stiff opposition to the idea. It helps to know the experiences and mindset of those with whom you are up against. Here is my ten cent analysis of the situation:
College administrators do spend a lot of time and effort dealing with immature students. Alcohol, drugs and mental illness are serious issues on all college campus. It is a minority of students and much of the problem is with "freshmen gone wild," but it colors the outlook of college administrators. Administrators are in effect parents who are expected to care for and protect immature kids from themselves. One challenge is to separate, in the minds of administrators, the concealed permit holder (21 years old, background check) from these "train wreck" students.
Secondly, there is strong opposition from most faculty. They too worry about their "train wreck" students upset over flunking a course.
Thirdly, the legislature respects the turf of the college administrators.
You would think that the positive record from states where campus carry is permitted would sway the minds of administrators and others, but they are reacting emotionally and not logically. They feel threatened by the idea of campus carry.
The challenge of Students For Concealed Carry and other supporters is to change attitudes. It is a slow process that cannot be accomplished by debating or awareness raising events, although these can be good things. Instead of "lecturing" to people it might be wise to respectfully ask them to share their concerns. Then use the information shared to develop well reasoned, non-argumentative responses.
Edited to add: When you speak out in favor of campus carry, you are challenging the authority and wisdom of campus administrators. If you do not have the ability to communicate diplomatically, they will not be receptive. Take the time to listen to their reasons for opposing campus carry and develop responses that are both respectful and constructive.
College administrators do spend a lot of time and effort dealing with immature students. Alcohol, drugs and mental illness are serious issues on all college campus. It is a minority of students and much of the problem is with "freshmen gone wild," but it colors the outlook of college administrators. Administrators are in effect parents who are expected to care for and protect immature kids from themselves. One challenge is to separate, in the minds of administrators, the concealed permit holder (21 years old, background check) from these "train wreck" students.
Secondly, there is strong opposition from most faculty. They too worry about their "train wreck" students upset over flunking a course.
Thirdly, the legislature respects the turf of the college administrators.
You would think that the positive record from states where campus carry is permitted would sway the minds of administrators and others, but they are reacting emotionally and not logically. They feel threatened by the idea of campus carry.
The challenge of Students For Concealed Carry and other supporters is to change attitudes. It is a slow process that cannot be accomplished by debating or awareness raising events, although these can be good things. Instead of "lecturing" to people it might be wise to respectfully ask them to share their concerns. Then use the information shared to develop well reasoned, non-argumentative responses.
Edited to add: When you speak out in favor of campus carry, you are challenging the authority and wisdom of campus administrators. If you do not have the ability to communicate diplomatically, they will not be receptive. Take the time to listen to their reasons for opposing campus carry and develop responses that are both respectful and constructive.
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As an alumnus and employee of a university in Oklahoma, I have seen this from both the viewpoint of a student and a campus administrator.
I hunted and went to a mentor's property to shoot about once or twice a month while attending the university. Campus policy does not allow weapons of any sort to be kept in campus housing. If I wanted to keep my firearms and ammunition on campus, I was required to check them in with the campus police department and then go check them out when I wanted to use them. I chose to keep my hunting firearms at my mentor's house instead. Another option that was protected by OK law would have been to keep my weapons stored in my truck, but there were already cases of vehicles being broken into and stolen so I chose not to do that. Good idea since my truck was stolen not long after I brought all my guns to school.
I also received my SDA permit while attending the university I now work for. For a period of about 10 months after receiving my permit, I both worked for the university as an employee and attended as a student. I talked with campus police about getting a letter from the president of the university granting permission to carry on campus, per the requirements of the SDA. The campus police department stated they would not have a problem with my carrying, but the president would only give a letter of permission to employees. Since I was still a student living on campus, I would not be able to receive a letter. Within a month of graduating, I received the letter of permission.
As a student, I do not understand the difference that my graduating made. I didn't magically mature or learn better firearm safety upon graduation. I'm sure it was all about preventing the university from setting a precedence that a student could carry on campus.
As an employee, I respect the university's right to determine what activities can occur on the campus. I also strongly believe, due to my experience and interaction with our executive administration, that if the university administration was given a way to allow students to carry while saving face with select groups of parents and certain donors, such as a new law being passed in OK that took the decision out of their hands, the majority of the student body and staff would not have any qualms over the issue. Unfortunately, parents and donors are the life force for most universities.
I hunted and went to a mentor's property to shoot about once or twice a month while attending the university. Campus policy does not allow weapons of any sort to be kept in campus housing. If I wanted to keep my firearms and ammunition on campus, I was required to check them in with the campus police department and then go check them out when I wanted to use them. I chose to keep my hunting firearms at my mentor's house instead. Another option that was protected by OK law would have been to keep my weapons stored in my truck, but there were already cases of vehicles being broken into and stolen so I chose not to do that. Good idea since my truck was stolen not long after I brought all my guns to school.
I also received my SDA permit while attending the university I now work for. For a period of about 10 months after receiving my permit, I both worked for the university as an employee and attended as a student. I talked with campus police about getting a letter from the president of the university granting permission to carry on campus, per the requirements of the SDA. The campus police department stated they would not have a problem with my carrying, but the president would only give a letter of permission to employees. Since I was still a student living on campus, I would not be able to receive a letter. Within a month of graduating, I received the letter of permission.
As a student, I do not understand the difference that my graduating made. I didn't magically mature or learn better firearm safety upon graduation. I'm sure it was all about preventing the university from setting a precedence that a student could carry on campus.
As an employee, I respect the university's right to determine what activities can occur on the campus. I also strongly believe, due to my experience and interaction with our executive administration, that if the university administration was given a way to allow students to carry while saving face with select groups of parents and certain donors, such as a new law being passed in OK that took the decision out of their hands, the majority of the student body and staff would not have any qualms over the issue. Unfortunately, parents and donors are the life force for most universities.
Fixed it for you. As for the "freshmen gone wild", freshmen transitioning from high school to college aren't eligible for an SDA permit. Using an ineligible category of students as an example is an intellectually dishonest tactic.
Yes it is. But just to clarify - I'm not making that argument.
Have you gone to the office of the president of the university and asked to be able to carry on campus? Until you have you can't actually say that you can't carry on campus. I may not agree with all of the provisions of the SDA, but for now that is what we have. I have worked for a university for over seven years. I know the secretaries in the presidents office and from time to time I stop by and ask if anyone as been in and asked for a letter from the president. In those seven years no one has been in and asked. I know that you may not like the rules as they are written, but until we get Article 2, Section 26 of the Oklahoma Constitution changed we will be limited by the state on where and when we can carry.
