Hey, legal opium did great things for China... oh, wait.
Hey, legal opium did great things for China... oh, wait.
I believe not only is that BS, I also believe the vast majority of people who abuse prescription drugs are breaking several laws on a daily basis.
The drug warrior argument is the same as the "blood will run through the streets if carrying guns is legal" argument. But whatever helps.
I've also seen (and personally known) "many of those types" and their root mental/emotional problems that cause them to do destructive drugs in the first place, and the hold addiction has on them once they start is stronger than any law. They're killing themselves, alienating their friends and family, going broke and they are fully aware of it, they don't give a rat's ass it's against the law. An addict's thought process doesn't include the ability to fear punishment, enough to alter their behavior drastically anyway. Drug abuse is just a symptom of other issues.
Also, the U.S has the highest drug use rates for several drugs in the entire world, in spite of having some of the strictest drug laws. The Drug War has been unable to show any significant decline in addiction rates, usage rates, or availability of drugs.
Our drug related incarceration rates certainly show people fear that punishment... (friendly tip, violent crime incarceration rates are not responsible for the quadrupling of the incarceration rate.) And their is a strange correlation between the increase and the following, but I can't quite figure out the the connection.
1970 - The Nixon administration implemented the Comprehensive Drug Abuse Prevention and Control Act of 1970.
1973 - The Drug Enforcement Administration was created.
1989 - The Office of National Drug Control Policy was created.
Good morning Mr. Hyperbole.
Show me some numbers. We got stricter, has it helped?
ETA: I also believe some people are just not fit to be functional in society. This woman is one of them. I think she would be a piece of sh*t without the drugs.
[cynical]Well that would certainly end the problem, wouldn't it?[/cynical]
The problem isn't so much what we legalize or ban, but how we deal with people who have these kind of problems.
As it was mentioned earlier, in another time (or a more sane society) her family would have said "you're nuts woman" and taken the child to safety. In 21st century America, we as a society are stuck between freedom and security, so we'll ban the drugs for safety, but then force people to give babies back to junkie mothers.
Sorry, RidgeHunter, but I couldn't disagree with you more. Your argument seems to intimate that stricter laws equates to more drug use. I think here in the US our prosperity is our problem. And the welfare state. Sitting at home smoking up your SSI check is a lot easier than scrounging a livingand food out of a bare dirt patch while living in a cardboard hut.
Don't ask me to feel too sorry for people who live off the gov't tit all while crying "Woe is me! I'm oppressed!"
I talk about what I see everyday. I'm sorry if your experiences differ, but that's the type of person I see... Every... Single... Day.
Oh well. Maybe I'm jaded... But it's the system! It's not my fault!
Lol
Don't ask me to feel too sorry for people who live off the gov't tit all while crying "Woe is me! I'm oppressed!"
I talk about what I see everyday. I'm sorry if your experiences differ, but that's the type of person I see... Every... Single... Day.
Oh well. Maybe I'm jaded... But it's the system! It's not my fault!
Lol
No, my argument is stricter drug laws have done nothing to curb illegal dug use, sales or addiction/usage rates since the W.O.D was ramped up in the 1970's....at the same time more than quadrupling our incarceration rate with drug offenders (which doesn't jive with you "they fear stricter punishment" argument.)
And it's not really an argument, it's just repeating hard facts.
I also argue that their is no truth to the "drug use would skyrocket" argument, when other prosperous countries with less strict drug laws don't have that problem. A claim we would have radically different results doesn't have much basis. Also there has been no real change for the better since the drug war was escalated, showing that getting stricter does not have dramatic effects on drug use like you claim.
A claim that 33-50% of a generation is waiting for a legal green light to OD is just plain ridiculous.
I'm not feeling sorry for government tit-suckers, I'm feeling sorry we have so many people that think Drug Prohibition is saving the world one possession charge at a time.
If your claims were true, shouldn't our incarceration rate have dropped (or at the very least, not more than quadrupled) since we "got tough on drugs"?
Shouldn't there be significantly less drugs available?
Should drug use rates not have dropped dramatically since the 1970's?
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Is it the drug at fault here or the person that was doing the drugs? I could see this egg donor getting wasted on a bottle of cheap whiskey and doing the same thing.
Not saying all drugs should be legal, face it guys, some people should not be responsible for a puppy even, whether sober or drunk or stoned. This person appears to be one of those people.
Besides, most people are for making pot legal, not meth and heroin and the such...... never heard of a pot head doing anything like this.
I dont do drugs, but faulting all drugs for this persons behaviour is like faulting all guns for some numbnut going on a shooting rampage.
Exactly what 'claims' have I made to that effect? I don't recall addressing any of those points, yet you seem to have no trouble attributing that stance to me.
Maybe I should go back and re-read to find out exactly what I said....
These.
I have no doubt in my mind whatsoever that if many of these drugs were legalized, this would become a much more frequent headline.
And this.
If your being strict on drugs had as dramatic an effect on usage as you are implying, then when we became stricter things should have dramatically changed for the better. The incarceration rate should not have skyrocketed. Usage rates would have dropped dramatically as penalties grew stiffer.
I bet you saved her life for sure. Good on you man.
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http://examiner-enterprise.com/articles/2010/11/08/news/news139.txt
BREAKING NEWS:
Monday, November 8, 2010 3:28 PM CST
Charges Changed: Mother of infant killed in washing machine charged with child neglect
By Tim Hudson
E-E County Reporter
A Bartlesville woman arrested in the death of her 10-day-old infant last week has been formally charged with child neglect.
Police had arrested 26-year-old Lyndsey Dawn Fiddler on Friday on charges of second degree manslaughter, but prosecutors said today that Fiddler is only being charged with child neglect.
“We anticipate additional charges will be filed,” District Attorney Rick Esser said today at Fiddler’s initial appearance on the charges.
Kesha Gray
Esser indicated that he was frustrated because some information had been given to media outlets but presumably not the district attorney’s office.
“We hope they (the Bartlesville Police Department) will give this to us first,” he said referring to information pertaining to the case.
According to a probable cause affidavit filed in the case, at around 7:42 p.m. Nov. 4, police received a report that a baby had been found in a washing machine by her great-aunt at a residence in the 500 block of Southeast Shawnee Avenue.
The woman reportedly told police that the child’s mother, Fiddler, had been incoherent and that she had been “hearing things that weren’t being said,” according to the affidavit. She further said that Fiddler “had been up for three days doing what she believed to be methamphetamine.”
She reportedly said that at one point Fiddler put the baby to bed and then “passed out in a chair.” The woman said that she later went back to check on the baby but could not find her and tried unsuccessfully to awaken Fiddler, the affidavit states.
She reportedly then said that Fiddler finally woke up and she asked her, “where’s the baby?” just as the washing machine came on. She reported that the washer sounded like it was in the spin cycle and that it was unbalanced. When she went to check on the washer, she noticed that the “ten day old infant, mixed in with the laundry” was inside, the report states. She said that she immediately knew that the child was dead.
When questioned by police, Fiddler denied “knowing how her baby got placed into the washing machine” and said that she had taken five hydrocodone pills earlier in the day, according to the affidavit. She reportedly denied that she used methamphetamine “anymore.”
A drug screen administered by police, however, reportedly returned positive for “methamphetamine, amphetamines, benzodiazepine, and opiates.”
According to the affidavit, “based on the unlawful death of infant child (initials removed) a ten day old child, caused by the culpable negligence of Lyndsey Dawn Fiddler,” authorities arrested her for second degree manslaughter.
Two other children were reportedly removed from Fiddler’s home by the Department of Human Services following the incident.
Fiddler remains in the Washington County Jail on $100,000 bond.
BREAKING NEWS:
Monday, November 8, 2010 3:28 PM CST
Charges Changed: Mother of infant killed in washing machine charged with child neglect
By Tim Hudson
E-E County Reporter
A Bartlesville woman arrested in the death of her 10-day-old infant last week has been formally charged with child neglect.
Police had arrested 26-year-old Lyndsey Dawn Fiddler on Friday on charges of second degree manslaughter, but prosecutors said today that Fiddler is only being charged with child neglect.
“We anticipate additional charges will be filed,” District Attorney Rick Esser said today at Fiddler’s initial appearance on the charges.
Kesha Gray
Esser indicated that he was frustrated because some information had been given to media outlets but presumably not the district attorney’s office.
“We hope they (the Bartlesville Police Department) will give this to us first,” he said referring to information pertaining to the case.
According to a probable cause affidavit filed in the case, at around 7:42 p.m. Nov. 4, police received a report that a baby had been found in a washing machine by her great-aunt at a residence in the 500 block of Southeast Shawnee Avenue.
The woman reportedly told police that the child’s mother, Fiddler, had been incoherent and that she had been “hearing things that weren’t being said,” according to the affidavit. She further said that Fiddler “had been up for three days doing what she believed to be methamphetamine.”
She reportedly said that at one point Fiddler put the baby to bed and then “passed out in a chair.” The woman said that she later went back to check on the baby but could not find her and tried unsuccessfully to awaken Fiddler, the affidavit states.
She reportedly then said that Fiddler finally woke up and she asked her, “where’s the baby?” just as the washing machine came on. She reported that the washer sounded like it was in the spin cycle and that it was unbalanced. When she went to check on the washer, she noticed that the “ten day old infant, mixed in with the laundry” was inside, the report states. She said that she immediately knew that the child was dead.
When questioned by police, Fiddler denied “knowing how her baby got placed into the washing machine” and said that she had taken five hydrocodone pills earlier in the day, according to the affidavit. She reportedly denied that she used methamphetamine “anymore.”
A drug screen administered by police, however, reportedly returned positive for “methamphetamine, amphetamines, benzodiazepine, and opiates.”
According to the affidavit, “based on the unlawful death of infant child (initials removed) a ten day old child, caused by the culpable negligence of Lyndsey Dawn Fiddler,” authorities arrested her for second degree manslaughter.
Two other children were reportedly removed from Fiddler’s home by the Department of Human Services following the incident.
Fiddler remains in the Washington County Jail on $100,000 bond.
