Zimmerman

[jmike314]

Lets not kid ourselves, TM was a thug as I see it in the evidence. That doent have a dang thing to do with his skin color BUT the majority of the black community are up in arms because he is dead. They give no accountability for his miss guided actions or maybe his lawfull actions, they want and eye for an eye. Now tell me thats not because a black teen was killed by a white/hispanic man.
Be trutfull here.
This is a racist trial 100%. Maybe your not racist, as I am not but the proof is in the puddin.

OK...Say TM was a thug. Say he had his history with the law. Say that he regularly smoked weed.
None of these are the reasons that GZ decided to stop TM that night...there's no way he could have known any of that prior. You and I and everyone else knows GZ went after him because he didn't look like he belonged there. Fine, he looked suspicious. Call the law and let them do their job. Since when does a neighborhood watch have the authority to question or detain? And he was told by 911 dispatch not to pursue...but he chose to do it anyway. TM was not doing anything illegal when GZ decided to pursue him...I have a big problem with that.

I do not doubt that GZ feared for his life, but he never should have been in the situation in the first place. There was an altercation - GZ felt threatened enough to draw his firearm - TM was shot and killed. GZ was in a fight for his life, but was he the one to instigate the fight to begin with? Or did TM turn and charge him? That changes things. Again, only 2 know the truth...one can't talk and the other ain't gonna talk.

This trial is a mess. Just like Jody Arias, Kaylee Anthony, Martha Stewart, Scott Pederson, O.J.....and the list goes on and on. Remember when trails happened and we read about the verdict in the paper? Now every cable news channel has a camera in the courtroom and are broadcasting live. There's no way this verdict comes down without backlash...either way the outcome is going to cause a flare up and we'll start this whole argument over again.

 

[Hobbes]

"These guys always get away".

 

[yukonjack]

OK...Say TM was a thug. Say he had his history with the law. Say that he regularly smoked weed.
None of these are the reasons that GZ decided to stop TM that night...there's no way he could have known any of that prior. You and I and everyone else knows GZ went after him because he didn't look like he belonged there. Fine, he looked suspicious. Call the law and let them do their job. Since when does a neighborhood watch have the authority to question or detain? And he was told by 911 dispatch not to pursue...but he chose to do it anyway. TM was not doing anything illegal when GZ decided to pursue him...I have a big problem with that.

I do not doubt that GZ feared for his life, but he never should have been in the situation in the first place. There was an altercation - GZ felt threatened enough to draw his firearm - TM was shot and killed. GZ was in a fight for his life, but was he the one to instigate the fight to begin with? Or did TM turn and charge him? That changes things. Again, only 2 know the truth...one can't talk and the other ain't gonna talk.

This trial is a mess. Just like Jody Arias, Kaylee Anthony, Martha Stewart, Scott Pederson, O.J.....and the list goes on and on. Remember when trails happened and we read about the verdict in the paper? Now every cable news channel has a camera in the courtroom and are broadcasting live. There's no way this verdict comes down without backlash...either way the outcome is going to cause a flare up and we'll start this whole argument over again.

You obviously don't pay attention. Zimmerman didn't stop anyone. Zimmerman didn't physically attack anyone. Dude, pay attention to the evidence that is coming out in the trial.

 

[Hobbes]

You obviously don't pay attention. Zimmerman didn't stop anyone. Zimmerman didn't physically attack anyone. Dude, pay attention to the evidence that is coming out in the trial.

That is the defense argument.

We don't KNOW what happened because only one man survived to tell his side.

 

[n2sooners]

OK...Say TM was a thug. Say he had his history with the law. Say that he regularly smoked weed.
None of these are the reasons that GZ decided to stop TM that night...there's no way he could have known any of that prior. You and I and everyone else knows GZ went after him because he didn't look like he belonged there. Fine, he looked suspicious. Call the law and let them do their job. Since when does a neighborhood watch have the authority to question or detain? And he was told by 911 dispatch not to pursue...but he chose to do it anyway. TM was not doing anything illegal when GZ decided to pursue him...I have a big problem with that.

I do not doubt that GZ feared for his life, but he never should have been in the situation in the first place. There was an altercation - GZ felt threatened enough to draw his firearm - TM was shot and killed. GZ was in a fight for his life, but was he the one to instigate the fight to begin with? Or did TM turn and charge him? That changes things. Again, only 2 know the truth...one can't talk and the other ain't gonna talk.

This trial is a mess. Just like Jody Arias, Kaylee Anthony, Martha Stewart, Scott Pederson, O.J.....and the list goes on and on. Remember when trails happened and we read about the verdict in the paper? Now every cable news channel has a camera in the courtroom and are broadcasting live. There's no way this verdict comes down without backlash...either way the outcome is going to cause a flare up and we'll start this whole argument over again.

Go listen to the 911 call in its entirety. The 911 operator NEVER told Zimmerman not to follow Martin. Zimmerman started following Martin when he ran. You can hear Zimmerman running on the recording. The operator then asked if he was following Martin, he said yes, the operator said 'we don't need you to do that' and within seconds Zimmerman said okay and the sounds of him running stopped. So even though he wasn't ordered to stop, he DID stop when the operator told him that they didn't need him to follow Martin. One of the biggest myths was that he was ordered not to follow or to stay in his car and then he chased Martin. And if you listen to the call you will also hear that he lost track of Martin. He was no longer following Martin because he didn't know where he was and he said so on the call when asked to give his address. The 911 call went on for a few minutes after he lost sight of Martin, plenty of time for Martin to get home if he was in fear for his life.

As for questioning or detaining, there is absolutely no evidence of that. It's not that it couldn't have happened, but that we don't know what happened during the few minutes between the end of Zimmerman's 911 call and neighbors hearing the fight except for what Zimmerman has said happened and what the girl on the phone with Martin said she heard. And from what she said it sounds like Martin may have decided to confront Zimmerman even though Zimmerman was no longer following him.

 

[Hobbes]

Go listen to the 911 call in its entirety. The 911 operator NEVER told Zimmerman not to follow Martin. Zimmerman started following Martin when he ran. You can hear Zimmerman running on the recording. The operator then asked if he was following Martin, he said yes, the operator said 'we don't need you to do that' and within seconds Zimmerman said okay and the sounds of him running stopped. So even though he wasn't ordered to stop, he DID stop when the operator told him that they didn't need him to follow Martin. One of the biggest myths was that he was ordered not to follow or to stay in his car and then he chased Martin. And if you listen to the call you will also hear that he lost track of Martin. He was no longer following Martin because he didn't know where he was and he said so on the call when asked to give his address. The 911 call went on for a few minutes after he lost sight of Martin, plenty of time for Martin to get home if he was in fear for his life.

As for questioning or detaining, there is absolutely no evidence of that. It's not that it couldn't have happened, but that we don't know what happened during the few minutes between the end of Zimmerman's 911 call and neighbors hearing the fight except for what Zimmerman has said happened and what the girl on the phone with Martin said she heard. And from what she said it sounds like Martin may have decided to confront Zimmerman even though Zimmerman was no longer following him.

Here is the tape of the final confrontation, screaming for help, and the gunshot.



The defense claims it is GZ screaming for help and the prosecution claims it is TM.

Listen and you will find that the screaming ceases at the instant of the gunshot.
If it was TM that is easy to explain because he was shot in the heart.
If it was GZ screaming why did he stop screaming for help at the sound of the gunshot?

 

[n2sooners]

Here is the tape of the final confrontation, screaming for help, and the gunshot.



The defense claims it is GZ screaming for help and the prosecution claims it is TM.

Listen and you will find that the screaming ceases at the instant of the gunshot.
If it was TM that is easy to explain because he was shot in the heart.
If it was GZ screaming why did he stop screaming for help at the sound of the gunshot?

Someone is on top of you beating your ass and you are screaming for help. You continue screaming for help as you try to wrestle your firearm out of its holster. You finally get it pointed upward and fire BANG!!! No hearing protection and there is a deafening bang. The shock would be enough for you to stop screaming.

Not saying that's what happened, just a possibility. I don't think it matters who was screaming for help. Martin was on top of Zimmerman going MMA style on his face. Should Zimmerman be less scared for his life if Martin is screaming help while doing so? Eyewitness and physical evidence puts Martin on top of Zimmerman. The most important question is did George Zimmerman have reason to fear great bodily harm or death? If so, it was self defense plain and simple.

 

[Hobbes]

Someone is on top of you beating your ass and you are screaming for help. You continue screaming for help as you try to wrestle your firearm out of its holster. You finally get it pointed upward and fire BANG!!! No hearing protection and there is a deafening bang. The shock would be enough for you to stop screaming.

Not saying that's what happened, just a possibility. I don't think it matters who was screaming for help. Martin was on top of Zimmerman going MMA style on his face. Should Zimmerman be less scared for his life if Martin is screaming help while doing so? Eyewitness and physical evidence puts Martin on top of Zimmerman. The most important question is did George Zimmerman have reason to fear great bodily harm or death? If so, it was self defense plain and simple.

You think GZ stopped screaming for help because the gun was so loud?

It was TM screaming for help because a man was pointing a gun at him.
A bullet to the heart stopped that screaming for help.

 

[Quick_Draw_McGraw]

You obviously don't pay attention. Zimmerman didn't stop anyone. Zimmerman didn't physically attack anyone. Dude, pay attention to the evidence that is coming out in the trial.

If stand your ground laws imply that you do not have an obligation to retreat from a threat, how is that not applicable to Martin? That's the major problem with this case. If someone is following you, you believe then intend you harm, stand your ground laws say you don't have to retreat.

This case will be detrimental to conceal and carry rights, because the grounds that Zimmermans case is built entirely around the fact that only he was eligible to defend himself. Zimmerman only had to defend himself, because he created a situation in which he was a perceived threat to another person. If he was a threat to Martin, then Martin should also have the right to defend himself, and under stand your ground laws, does not have a legal obligation to retreat. Stand your ground laws, while mainly intended for gun owners, applies to any scenario in which you meet a threat with physical force rather then meeting a threat with retreat.

 

[LightningCrash]

The prosecution would like to call Hobbes to the witness stand.