Interesting Opinion from a Gun Shop Guy Today

[ttownokie]

Actually society does agree, this is the law!, It is I have no liability at all for this. It is not my responsibility to prove someone is not a felon before selling them a weapon! The law does not require I do this.

 

[ttownokie]

It's just not worth it too waste my time on needless things like atf forms. I have no contract with the atf, so why would i willingly enter into a contract with a government agency. No benefit at all to me, all its does is support bs government agencies and wasting tax payer dollars. I'll keep my privacy and freedom thanks!

 

[Poke78]

As long as you sell it privately within the prescribed laws and you did not knowingly sell it to a felon you have nothing to worry about....no paper work needed. Please cite a case where someone who sold a gun privately within the laws got into trouble. I could cite several cases where a gun was sold privately (no paperwork) and then used in crime and there was no problems for the seller.

Go read the Tulsa World article from a couple of days ago on the route taken by the Glock involved in the killing of those girls in Weleetka. The article was about the preliminary hearing and they even brought in a Glock rep from GA to start the chain.

The question becomes about the final transaction from a reserve police officer to the accused killer when the perp was working at a McD's drive-thru window. I'm not saying anything was done wrong or illegally but I suspect the transaction may be given a close eye yet.

 

[roachjuice]

Oh I don't know, what do tow truck companies charge?

 

[Billybob]

Wonder how many $10 transfers you can find in states that require a ffl transfer between private parties?

ILLINOIS SECURE FIREARM

Sale & Transfer Corp

TRANSFER FEE CHANGE:

Transfer fee from an FFL holder is still 25.00 per firearm, plus 2.00 for the NICS check.

Transfer fee from a private party (not an FFL holder) is 65.00 per firearm plus a 2.00 NICS fee. Seller must furnish a color copy of his government issued photo ID with permanent residence address and date of birth included

http://www.illinoissecurefirearm.com/illinoissecurefirearm/Main.html

 

[Cinaet]

If you were a FFL holder/gun store owner/gun show table owner which would benefit your business most? A law that forces federal approval/registration between private parties or the freedom for anyone to privately sell/buy firearms?

 

[Poke78]

Just a question. Should not an estate sale go through a FFL holder? It seems that all of the drawings that I have entered to win guns went through an FFL.

How is a drawing/raffle like an estate sale? In the case of a raffle, a winning ticket means you fill out the 4473 for the FFL because the Kiwanis/Rotary/etc. never really bought it from the FFL, they're just paying him for the item you're receiving as the winner. In the case of an auction-type estate sale, auctioneers bring an FFL to an auction/estate sale for transfer/legal purposes since the auction company is a business but does not hold an FFL so they do the CYA thing. They've likely gotten guidance from a lawyer or the BATFE directly on this. OTOH, items can be held out from the estate for a separate sale with the executor selling as an agent for the estate to an individual so state law applies. In OK, that's a basic FTF sale with no papers required.

I'm also aware of gun shops that provide valuation services for estates as part of a disposal process so that also has to go through their bound book if they are the sales agent.

 

[EFsDad]

How is a drawing/raffle like an estate sale?

Sorry, I should also have said that I have been to benefits where they auctioned firearms and they made sure to mention that the auctioneer had FFL for instant transfer after the check. Also at a GOA dinner that I went to, they had all of them in under one FFL after all the other FFL's donate/transfer to the one in charge.

Thanks for straightening me out on the process/behind the scenes. I've always wondered how and why.

 

[cktad]

Go read the Tulsa World article from a couple of days ago on the route taken by the Glock involved in the killing of those girls in Weleetka. The article was about the preliminary hearing and they even brought in a Glock rep from GA to start the chain.

The question becomes about the final transaction from a reserve police officer to the accused killer when the perp was working at a McD's drive-thru window. I'm not saying anything was done wrong or illegally but I suspect the transaction may be given a close eye yet.

Yes, they will have questions about the transaction but so what. It's part of any criminal investigation. As long as it was within the laws covering private transactions the seller is not in any trouble.

 

[ez bake]

This is correct, I have no obligation to prove that the person I am selling to does not have a previous felony conviction.

Personally, i think the idea that a felon cannot own a firearms is ridiculous, if they have served their time they are freemen, and freemen have all natural rights as everybody else! Never mind that the majority of "felons" are not for violent offenses.

Now regardless of what I think of that, the way the law is written today is that I can not knowingly sell to a felon. But I have no obligation to prove they are not!

I'm not trying to pass laws here, nor am I trying to point fingers. I'm just saying, if you had all the tools to check whether a person was a felon or not before you sold him/her the gun and did not, you don't feel any personal responsibility for the crimes that criminal commits with your former gun? What if they were specifically a violent criminal? What if the person is acting suspicious?

Seriously (just for my own curiosity), where is the line that makes you personally uncomfortable making a FTF sale?

If we don't want laws passed forcing us to go through an FFL or NICS check, then we might want to think about doing some in-house prevention on our own (weren't some of you just commenting on putting heads in the sand in the other thread?).