Ah ok. I know what those are, just never knew what they were called. Thanks okfireman.
Ah ok. I know what those are, just never knew what they were called. Thanks okfireman.
I don't know why the administrators do not see that the mass shootings occur in gun free zones. A shooter has no problem with violating any rule concerning firearms on campus, because he has one purpose, to kill as many people as he can before he is killed or kills himsele/herself.
If responsible citizens are allowed to carry firearms concealed on any school campus, and a shooter comes with the intent of killing folks, the shooting will most likely be over and the shooter dead before LEO's can even arrive on the scene.
The armed citizen should be sitting in a chair near the dead shooter with his firearm unloaded and in plain sight about 20 feet away. He should be on the phone to 911 first to report the situation and then on the phone to his lawyer to keep him, the shooter, not the lawyer, from going to jail .
The campus cops have never been able to prevent deaths on any campus anywhere, so what will change the next time someone decides to kill on a campus. Nothing.
JMHO
If responsible citizens are allowed to carry firearms concealed on any school campus, and a shooter comes with the intent of killing folks, the shooting will most likely be over and the shooter dead before LEO's can even arrive on the scene.
The armed citizen should be sitting in a chair near the dead shooter with his firearm unloaded and in plain sight about 20 feet away. He should be on the phone to 911 first to report the situation and then on the phone to his lawyer to keep him, the shooter, not the lawyer, from going to jail .
The campus cops have never been able to prevent deaths on any campus anywhere, so what will change the next time someone decides to kill on a campus. Nothing.
JMHO
As an employee of a college i can see both sides of the argument. What i don't want to see is people forced to be helpless. At the college i work at, and others you can have a weapon in your vehicle, just not in the buildings. I personally like the idea of concealed carry everywhere, the problem i have is with the training. I don't feel that anyone carrying an Oklahoma ccl is trained at a level they should be. Zero weapon retention training, Zero training at engaging multiple targets, Zero training at engaging both friendly and hostile targets. Zero training about understanding your backdrop on indoor shooting scenarios.
The argument for more training has some merit but is also a slippery slope. Voluntary training is great but mandatory training quickly turns into a barrier and is often accompanied by all sorts of other restrictions - mental health testing etc.
Some points to keep in mind:
- Some states (Indiana?, Vermont...) require zero training to carry concealed and have no problems as a result.
- The police officer who shot at the snake in the bird house and killed the child in Noble was CLEET trained I believe. Did the training prevent this?
- There's no difference between many potential sites on a college campus and off (churches, theaters etc) so no justification for specialized training to carry on a college campus.
- Advanced training costs significant money and would exclude poorer people.
Once again it boils down to either trusting the average citizen/responsible adult to do the right thing or not to trust them. I trust them.
Imagine if voters began sending their state representatives the following sorts of letters every year:
Dear Legislator,
Today, April 16th, is the anniversary of the Virginia Tech massacre. A mentally unstable person killed 32 helpless students and staff. Helpless because state law and school policy prevented any of the victims from carrying a legal concealed handgun, in violation of their 2nd Amendment right to do so.
How many more lives will be lost before you act to restore the 2nd Amendment on our college campuses and public schools? Responsible adults with concealed carry permits deserve to be able to carry in these places just as they are allowed to do so everywhere else. The experience of colleges in Utah indicate that it is the prudent thing to do. "Gun free" zones do not work.
Respectfully yours,
John Smith
Hometown
Other major massacre anniversaries:
Northern Illinois University, February 14th, 6 killed
Red Lake Senior High School, March 21, 8 killed
Columbine High School, April 20, 13 killed
Dear Legislator,
Today, April 16th, is the anniversary of the Virginia Tech massacre. A mentally unstable person killed 32 helpless students and staff. Helpless because state law and school policy prevented any of the victims from carrying a legal concealed handgun, in violation of their 2nd Amendment right to do so.
How many more lives will be lost before you act to restore the 2nd Amendment on our college campuses and public schools? Responsible adults with concealed carry permits deserve to be able to carry in these places just as they are allowed to do so everywhere else. The experience of colleges in Utah indicate that it is the prudent thing to do. "Gun free" zones do not work.
Respectfully yours,
John Smith
Hometown
Other major massacre anniversaries:
Northern Illinois University, February 14th, 6 killed
Red Lake Senior High School, March 21, 8 killed
Columbine High School, April 20, 13 killed
Would you agree with a stipulation than people should be required to carry for 2 years before they can carry at certain restricted places? This wouldn't restrict people like you were saying, but would require a person to have experience before carrying in a place such as schools.
No! What does carrying for two years have to do with anything? And it would restrict those that have just started carrying. Infringed is infringed. Period.
I don't see a difference between carrying in a college classroom and in a movie theater. Both are crowded with people. We have quite a few years of experience with concealed carry in crowded places like this and I don't know of any incident in which a concealed permit holder went wild and started shooting indiscriminately when under pressure.
Beware of trying to legislate to protect everyone from everything - it's not possible and there are going to be unintended negative consequences, such as there not being a firearm in a good guy's possession when it is badly needed.
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