What is the state law on producing I.D. on demand from law enforcement

[jakeman]

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[TedKennedy]

Well, this has been an interesting read.

Way back when we had three kids at home the wife and family all went out to eat. Afterwards, we took a drive east of Tulsa towards Tenkiller. I got offthe turnpike near Muskogee and was apparently speeding. Got pulled over by two cops, one in a typical uniform, the other dressed up like he was going to assault Waco.

I presented my license, insurance, was asked to step out of the car. Waco cop wants to search the vehicle, I said no. He goes up to passenger side and asks my wife for her ID. She says she doesn't have it and he tries to read her the riot act saying "you must present ID..etc..."

She said "what law says that?" and Waco cop goes back to me and the seemingly normal cop. Normal cop says "slow down going through here, have a safe drive".

 

[queenjohnson1791]

Back when JD Sharp was the OK County Sheriff, I knew a couple of deputies who worked for him, and one told me about an incident involving the Valleybrook PD, a notoriously bad outfit that basically thrived on being a speed trap and harassing the attendees of their numerous naked lady joints. (True but funny aside--Valleybrook had to refund a metric buttload of money collected from tickets written by cops operating radar units that were not kept current on their calibrations--and the officers weren't kept current on their certifications to operate them, either. Oops.)

This was 25 or so years ago, back when Crossroads Mall was still a going concern, and things were really hopping around the mall during the Christmas season. A couple of OK County reserve deputies had gone there to do some Christmas shopping (off duty), and were sneaking out the back way to avoid the traffic snarl out the main exits. This took them through Valleybrook, and being in a personal car, it got the attention of Valleybrook's finest.

He pulls them over and asks for license and insurance, so the driver pulls out his wallet, which has his reserve deputy badge in it. VBPD's finest then pulls him out of the car, cuffs him, and stuffs him in the back for impersonating an officer. Then he says to the other guy, "I bet you have one, too," whereupon he produces his reserve deputy badge, and promptly gets cuffed and stuffed for impersonating an officer.

This is when VBPD's finest makes his fatal mistake. He takes the two to OK County to book them.

The guy telling me the story said the Lieutenant walks in on the scene and just about comes un-freaking-glued, and tells VBPD to get his men un-cuffed immediately or he's going to be spending the night in the county lockup.

Fast forward to the next day, and JD calls in all the deputies and undersheriffs, and they take a field trip to Valleybrook, where they proceed to arrest everyone in the Valleybrook PD. They haul them back to OK County, fingerprint them, and inprocess them, then set them all down in a room and JD comes in and tells them "this is how it's gonna be."

I don't know about what happened under the doofus who replaced JD a few years later, but OK County never had any more trouble with Valleybrook on JD's watch.

As funny as this story is, it shows just how out of control police departments can be. This story demonstrates to me the common attitude amongst them is that they are above the laws, rules, polices, regulations and procedures of society and their departments. It is sad that they had no qualms wasting tax dollar money and valuable resources for a pissing contest. Another words they believe they can do what ever they want without consequences, after all who is going to really police the police!

 

[Gadsden]

First off I would like to say thank you to all the Men and Women in Law Enforcement, I believe overall you folks are doing a fine job, and are in a very tuff position with all the politics happening with your chosen career. My personal experience with the officers I have encountered has not been just, with the exception of one officer. What I mean is in one way or another my rights where violated. I am not a criminal or the typical expected targeted individual. More than once I have been concerned I may not go home to my Family, due to a law enforcement encounter. This is not how civilians should feel about law enforcement. There should be a level of trust! I'm sorry but I don't trust a single one of you, my personal experience is you are gang bangers with badges, being bullies just cause you can, however I respect all of you till you give me a reason otherwise. And if I seen any officer in trouble I wouldn't hesitate to help! Officers, as a civilian I ask all of you to uphold that oath you took, it means more than any individual! That is your promise too us! The reason we give you power, the reason we give you trust. And Officers I ask you to hold your follow Officers to these standards! Do this across the nation and trust may be restored in my opinion.

Gadsden based on comments about San Francisco, it seems to me that you may be a subscriber of the msm. People who are not from California always want to talk about San Francisco as the root of all problems there because that is what the msm tells you. Politics is where the problem really started there. They let all the criminals out of jail, at the same time took the guns away from the honest civilians by demonizing guns and those who have them for self defense, changing policy and law so you are less apt to defend yourself and others, decriminalization of theft under $1000 initially, I think it's $1900 now, so police no longer respond to theft calls, ( many years before defund the police movement started) changing slogans from " To protect and serve" to 'We'll kick your ass" are just a few of the things that went wrong in California, and just further declined into anarchy. This is what happens when you allow politicians and police to stomp your rights a little at a time.
The Mercury News
www.mercurynews.com
'We'll kick your ass' slogan on sheriff's patrol cars becomes issue in excessive force trial

The trolls are out in force obviously and like was already pointed out by another member, I believe this one is a twofer. Oh well, just another for the ignore feature and that will end THIS one’s blabbering string of BS.

 

[queenjohnson1791]

The trolls are out in force obviously and like was already pointed out by another member, I believe this one is a twofer. Oh well, just another for the ignore feature and that will end THIS one’s blabbering string of BS.

A typical response, for not having a response. Im not sure what my blabbering string of bs was, would you care to elaborate? Or perhaps it is just that you do not care for my opinions, and that is fine we can agree to disagree!

 

[OK Corgi Rancher]

A typical response, for not having a response. Im not sure what my blabbering string of bs was, would you care to elaborate? Or perhaps it is just that you do not care for my opinions, and that is fine we can agree to disagree!

I'll give you a response...

Do you have any idea how contradicting and stupid your response to the story is? You complain there's no one to "police the police" and how departments are out of control, blah, blah, blah. Yet the story illustrates just the opposite. The police (OK...sheriff's deputies) DID police the police.

"Another words", your response doesn't make sense.

FFS...what happened to critical thinking skills?

 

[queenjohnson1791]

I'll give you a response...

Do you have any idea how contradicting and stupid your response to the story is? You complain there's no one to "police the police" and how departments are out of control, blah, blah, blah. Yet the story illustrates just the opposite. The police (OK...sheriff's deputies) DID police the police.

"Another words", your response doesn't make sense.

FFS...what happened to critical thinking skills?

Actually the contradiction was the point! (A critical thinker might have spotted that ). Two police departments harassing and arresting each other over a pissing contest! I would define that as out of control! And I seriously doubt any of them have a record of those arrest. I guess a third department needed to step in, and tell them they where acting like children! Who actually policed them in a lawful manner? Your response further supports my opinion on the fact the Police as a whole believe they can do as they please without recourse.

 

[OK Corgi Rancher]

Double down on stupid. Good tactic. It doesn't matter what I say or anyone else says if it doesn't comport with your preconceived views on law enforcement. If you gave any indication you might be willing to consider alternative viewpoints I might find it easier to engage with you.

"Another words", we're not likely to ever agree on this...and I'm fine with that.

 

[Johnny]

Actually the contradiction was the point! (A critical thinker might have spotted that ). Two police departments harassing and arresting each other over a pissing contest! I would define that as out of control! And I seriously doubt any of them have a record of those arrest. I guess a third department needed to step in, and tell them they where acting like children! Who actually policed them in a lawful manner? Your response further supports my options on the fact the Police as a whole believe they can do as they please without recourse.

Only real way to stop a pissing contest is a boxing match.

 

[queenjohnson1791]

Double down on stupid. Good tactic. It doesn't matter what I say or anyone else says if it doesn't comport with your preconceived views on law enforcement. If you gave any indication you might be willing to consider alternative viewpoints I might find it easier to engage with you.

"Another words", we're not likely to ever agree on this...and I'm fine with that.

Alternative view points are very welcomed, can you offer some? Or will they be the same that you have been sticking with so far? I welcome a productive conversation.
Can we talk about the real point here, is it okay to disobey the oath of office that all officers swear to uphold? Is there ever a circumstance where this is okay? And if so why?
I leave those questions open for everyone to answer.
This should be a open discussion free of personal attacks, just cause feelers get involved! Let's talk like adults used too do.