Racism at OU

[nofearfactor]

Of course. If he didn't take swift action the entire nation would have torn him and OU a new *******.

Worst case scenario and they sue, he still wins. He covered all the bases he could. From the minute he showed up at the sunrise protest, he's been consistent.

How do politicians get in trouble after a scandal? By not be visible, vocal, present and consistent.

This. With the entire world looking at him what is he supposed to do? Give them a pass all in the name of free speech? He does that and this place (Norman) would go up in flames just like Ferguson Mo. You'll have every protester in the country in Norman. And Oklahoma. Anyone want that? In the name of free speech? He probably shocked the entire world by taking the swift and immediate action that he did. In spite of maybe stepping on what rights they may have. Unlike other places where an 'investigation' has had to be performed before any action could be taken, Boren kicked some azz and goterdone.

 

[sh00ter]

That's one of the problems OSAs defenders of free speech and defenders of these boys ain't getting.

They confessed and apologized. They acknowledge they were wrong. Yet the defenders on OSA wont.

If you include me in that group, I make no apologies...I have condemned what they said. I think they helped to forward a stereotype of rich white people and they hurt us too and not just the feelings of black people. It sounds like this is bigger than just one chant on a bus which reaffirms my opinion that the national fraternity should investigate and deal with any problems in the local chapter; before the University stepped in. But at the end of the day, despite everything JB just said as being spot on, this was some drunk punks in a sealed bus and not antagonists out in the face of black people. Someone within the frat should have been the bigger person when this chant first got started (several years ago?) and dealt with it. In this age of information there is no real privacy anymore. But the over-reactions and militant political correctness combined with the double standards applied to racial issues tends to fuel this kind of rebellion. These kids were narcissists and sheep more than they were racist...I'd be willing to bet that some who helped to sing the song do not even feel that way in their hearts. But due to the past of this nation, this is a cross we must bear forever apparently...but to me, this incident re-affirmed that it is hard to be a racist in 2015 and the reaction (even over reaction) should prove to black people that the rest of society will not put up with it and covert racism is all that can exist because when it becomes overt, it is rejected immediately. Perhaps if they had kept the place open but only dealt with the proven offenders, there could have been a change in that chapter from a lesson learned...we'll never know.

 

[Lurker66]

If you include me in that group, I make no apologies...I have condemned what they said. I think they helped to forward a stereotype of rich white people and they hurt us too and not just the feelings of black people. It sounds like this is bigger than just one chant on a bus which reaffirms my opinion that the national fraternity should investigate and deal with any problems in the local chapter; before the University stepped in. But at the end of the day, despite everything JB just said as being spot on, this was some drunk punks in a sealed bus and not antagonists out in the face of black people. Someone within the frat should have been the bigger person when this chant first got started (several years ago?) and dealt with it. In this age of information there is no real privacy anymore. But the over-reactions and militant political correctness combined with the double standards applied to racial issues tends to fuel this kind of rebellion. These kids were narcissists and sheep more than they were racist...I'd be willing to bet that some who helped to sing the song do not even feel that way in the heart. But due to the past of this nation, this is a cross we must bear forever apparently...but to me, this incident re-affirmed that it is hard to be a racist in 2015 and the reaction (even over reaction) should prove to black people that the rest of society will not put up with it and covert racism is all that can exist because when it becomes overt, it is rejected immediately. Perhaps if they had kept the place open but only dealt with the proven offenders, there could ahve been a change in that chapter from a lesson learned...we'll never know.

Whatever. These fellas ain't victims of anything other than thier own stupidity. This never was about free speech or rights. Just stupid people singing stupid chants.

It's a valiant effort by a couple to try to defend this fiasco by making it about free speech but since it wasn't ever about free speech it's in vain.

Free Speech is a strong as ever at OU, nobody is afraid to exercise their right to free speech. But there probably is a few people wondering if they were caught on video saying something stupid as well.

 

[sh00ter]

Whatever. These fellas ain't victims of anything other than thier own stupidity. This never was about free speech or rights. Just stupid people singing stupid chants.

It's a valiant effort by a couple to try to defend this fiasco by making it about free speech but since it wasn't ever about free speech it's in vain.

Free Speech is a strong as ever at OU, nobody is afraid to exercise their right to free speech. But there probably is a few people wondering if they were caught on video saying something stupid as well.

I am not claiming the frat boys were victims at all...I am claiming that they gave other white people a bad name in pulling this garbage.

However, they were in private (or so they thought)...facts like that do matter when you analyze such a sensitive situation...it doesn't take away from the ugliness of what they said, but does it really warrant an international story when we have ISIS murdering people, and Hilary breaking the law, etc.? How much did this event hurt black people verses the knock-out game hurt white people? Which was illegal and which was not? Is it right to call for violence or to show up at the homes of the parents Lurker? Where do you draw the line now that these guys have been removed?

"The football team refused to practice this week, their first week of spring football, in light of the SAE video."

These football players get special treatment, fame, women, and grew up in the are of Sony PlayStation and not segregation...is this solidarity with the civil rights pioneers or is it just laziness? A black guy I know who's an OSU fan said "these boys (OU players) are just being ridiculous now; Boren already tossed the frat off campus man". He thinks the frat boys were ignorant more than racist; I thought that was a very fair and surprising perspective. Lotta black folks have shown incredible class during this scandal. I admit that I personally would be more angry if the frat boys had gone out to confront people rather than just sing a drunken song. But now they've made themselves look like idiots worldwide...it's just Darwinism in all it's glory LOL.

http://newsok.com/university-of-okl...tion-into-fraternity-officers/article/5400707

 

[Lurker66]

The were in private...facts like that do matter when you analyze such a sensitive situation...it doesn't take away from the ugliness of what they said, but does it really warrant an international story when we have ISIS murdering people, and Hilary breaking the law, etc.? How much did this event hurt black people verses the knock-out game hurt white people? Which was illegal and which was not? Is it right to call for violence or to show up at the homes of the parents Lurker? Where do you draw the line now that these guys have been removed?

"The football team refused to practice this week, their first week of spring football, in light of the SAE video."

These football players get special treatment, fame, women, and grew up in the are of Sony PlayStation and not segregation...is this solidarity with the civil rights pioneers or is it just laziness? A black guy I work with who's an OSU fan said "now these boys (OU players) are just being ridiculous now; Boren already tossed the frat off campus man"

http://newsok.com/university-of-okl...tion-into-fraternity-officers/article/5400707

They were not "in private". If me n you walk in a room on your property, close the door and chant racist stuff, that's private. If you record our chant then it's not private.

These guys were on a bus, going down a street, chanting racist stuff for a camera. That doesn't equal private and it doesn't equal free speech......it does equal stupid.

Please try another angle tho. Defending stupid is a challenge and good practice.

Personally I'd argue they paid for the semester and deserve to be reimbursed. Stupidity probably doesn't cover that.

Edit...also try really hard to separate what they did, what the school did from totally unrelated things that ain't part of the story. Knock out games and ISIS and how the football team is treated.

And too bad for the parents. Maybe they shoulda booted their boys out in the street full of protesters to teach them that running your mouth has consequences.

 

[sh00ter]

They were not "in private". If me n you walk in a room on your property, close the door and chant racist stuff, that's private. If you record our chant then it's not private.

These guys were on a bus, going down a street, chanting racist stuff for a camera. That doesn't equal private and it doesn't equal free speech......it does equal stupid.

Please try another angle tho. Defending stupid is a challenge and good practice.

Personally I'd argue they paid for the semester and deserve to be reimbursed. Stupidity probably doesn't cover that.

Edit...also try really hard to separate what they did, what the school did from totally unrelated things that ain't part of the story. Knock out games and ISIS and how the football team is treated.

And too bad for the parents. Maybe they shoulda booted their boys out in the street full of protesters to teach them that running your mouth has consequences.

Yes, I'm sure we will all feel better if they are beaten into a coma; it will save many innocent people from having their feeling hurt in the future...c'mon Lurker...

I was making my privacy claim not taking into account the camera...I don't think they intended to record it and publish it for the world to see. They took the risk though...at least we know who they are now so we can send people to their house LOL. Two wrongs don't make a right...this was about a 3 on the scale of 1-10 "racism". I hope they learned their lesson though...I have said their chant was offensive. Hopefully you've at least heard that part despite our other disagreements.

 

[inactive]

What about the other one? Heck, maybe even the other two. Even OU is saying that they've expelled students over the matter. Someone either got expelled, or some people at OU and the media are lying.

These are not mutually exclusive. Dropping classes and withdrawing means you no longer go there, at least through the end of the term. Expulsion means you've also been barred from ever attending there. You can, in theory, expel a student enrolled in 0 credit hours.

I don't think Boren/OU would be able to succeed (my opinion) in a "hostile environment" defense when the fact that they were in a sealed bus is taken into consideration.

There's really no such thing as a sealed bus when they're a university sanctioned group meeting with another university group (the sorority attending the mixer, also on the bus) on their way to a university-sanctioned event. It'd be like saying an athlete could say whatever they want at halftime in the locker room, or a professor saying it to a department head while in a faculty meeting, or the landscaping crew chanting while working on the boiler at the physical plant. In all those instances, it's university business based on their collective affiliation with university and the capacity in which they are meeting.

Like it or not, the idea of a student group acting in this matter is far worse than the actions of an individual.

 

[Lurker66]

Yes, I'm sure we will all feel better if they are beaten into a coma; it will save many innocent people from having their feeling hurt in the future...c'mon Lurker...

I was making my privacy claim not taking into account the camera...I don't think they intended to record it and publish it for the world to see. They took the risk though...at least we know who they are now so we can send people to their house LOL. Two wrongs don't make a right...this was about a 3 on the scale of 1-10 "racism". I hope they learned their lesson though...I have said their chant was offensive. Hopefully you've at least heard that part despite our other disagreements.

Dear Mr. sh00ter, you have met your match in your stubbornness and tenacity for arguing this into oblivion. We can agree these guys were stupid for their chant.

Anything beyond that, whether it's free speech, lawsuits, privacy, ISIS or the football team is just beating a dead horse. I'll kick it as long as you want or until a mod locks the thread.

So dig your heels in and tell the rest of OSA you're gonna argue senseless points. Even Tim McVeigh had a Lawyer.

 

[soonerwings]

Dear Mr. sh00ter, you have met your match in your stubbornness and tenacity for arguing this into oblivion. We can agree these guys were stupid for their chant.

Anything beyond that, whether it's free speech, lawsuits, privacy, ISIS or the football team is just beating a dead horse. I'll kick it as long as you want or until a mod locks the thread.

So dig your heels in and tell the rest of OSA you're gonna argue senseless points. Even Tim McVeigh had a Lawyer.

Yeah!! Those free speech rights are just silly until you want to use them on a privately owned forum. Then they're for the growth of the community.


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[Cinaet]

Does Boren have an obligation to protect the university more than he does the student's 1A rights? Does his role as president mean that he needs to look out for how this incident will impact both the educational environment on campus, as well as the 'business' of competing for future students and donations?

Absolutely. His first responsibility is to protect the university. And he's done it as well as can be done. He immediately started separating the university from the act. He condemned the cancer and cut it out.