About shooting at a moving target; I've been around several shooters taking game at extended ranges and no one shoots at a moving animal. One advantage of taking game at extended ranges is the fact they have no idea there's anyone around. A loud whistle will work wonders to keep them still long enough for a round's 1 second flight time.
D&T - what method do you use to compesate for environmental changes? I'm using density altitude which seems to be working for the most part. I've noticed some error, not any more than 1/4 moa, probably just a rounding issue.
D&T - what method do you use to compesate for environmental changes? I'm using density altitude which seems to be working for the most part. I've noticed some error, not any more than 1/4 moa, probably just a rounding issue.
Fluxed,
congratulations on your long range Idaho mule deer - nice shooting...
There are a lot of guys building rifles around the Sako TRG and the 338 Lapua. Excellent choice by the way...
When I lived in Mississippi, my late wife's uncle had a piece of property he let me shoot on all the time. It was al old abandoned air strip that they use to land crop dusting planes on, back in the 60's. There was still a 20 wide section that was 1,382 yds. long, from end to end. Mr. Jack helped me clean this "air strip" from briars, weeds, saplings and such and it made for a most perfect shooting range. Just about as flat as a table top and as clean as any golf course. I mowed the place a couple of times a year but, between the cows, deer and turkey, I don't think I ever had to mow it any more than that...
The left side of the air strip, it's full length, was bordered by huge oak and pine trees, which made for a natural wind break. We had this range marked in 100 yd. increments for the first 600 yds. and then each 50 yds. after that. Our markers were 6 ft. steel posts with different colored ribbons on each post. Our charts showed us what distance each colored flag was. These same flags were used as wind flags, and depending on how much the flag was angled away from the post, it allowed us to determine the approximate wind speed...
A simple test we did one day, was to see how much of an effect your "grip" can have on gun movement at 1,000 yds.. With me sitting at the shooting bench, bolt removed from the gun, using gallon milk jugs for "targets", I would center the crosshairs on one jug and each time my hand pulsed, the crosshairs would move left of the target. I would tell Bill, through radio communication, to move the second jug to where it coincided with the crosshairs at each pulse. Point being, I was centered on one target, and the pulse in my hand made the crosshairs bounce to the second target, just from a relative firm grip on the pistol grip of the stock. When the test was concluded, there was a 22 ft. gap between the two jugs - just from hand pressure! EVERY little thing comes into play, when shooting long range....
congratulations on your long range Idaho mule deer - nice shooting...
There are a lot of guys building rifles around the Sako TRG and the 338 Lapua. Excellent choice by the way...
When I lived in Mississippi, my late wife's uncle had a piece of property he let me shoot on all the time. It was al old abandoned air strip that they use to land crop dusting planes on, back in the 60's. There was still a 20 wide section that was 1,382 yds. long, from end to end. Mr. Jack helped me clean this "air strip" from briars, weeds, saplings and such and it made for a most perfect shooting range. Just about as flat as a table top and as clean as any golf course. I mowed the place a couple of times a year but, between the cows, deer and turkey, I don't think I ever had to mow it any more than that...
The left side of the air strip, it's full length, was bordered by huge oak and pine trees, which made for a natural wind break. We had this range marked in 100 yd. increments for the first 600 yds. and then each 50 yds. after that. Our markers were 6 ft. steel posts with different colored ribbons on each post. Our charts showed us what distance each colored flag was. These same flags were used as wind flags, and depending on how much the flag was angled away from the post, it allowed us to determine the approximate wind speed...
A simple test we did one day, was to see how much of an effect your "grip" can have on gun movement at 1,000 yds.. With me sitting at the shooting bench, bolt removed from the gun, using gallon milk jugs for "targets", I would center the crosshairs on one jug and each time my hand pulsed, the crosshairs would move left of the target. I would tell Bill, through radio communication, to move the second jug to where it coincided with the crosshairs at each pulse. Point being, I was centered on one target, and the pulse in my hand made the crosshairs bounce to the second target, just from a relative firm grip on the pistol grip of the stock. When the test was concluded, there was a 22 ft. gap between the two jugs - just from hand pressure! EVERY little thing comes into play, when shooting long range....
Deer have no idea you are anywhere in the world at these longer ranges. I try to silhouette myself against the edge of a wood line if possible and most of the time, I will back up into the woods as much as practical. This keeps me outta sight and reduces glare from the sun, early in the morning and late in the evening...
I still have all the charts and graphs from my Sniping days that covered altitude differences, barometric pressures, up hill / down hill shooting, etc.. Now days though, since I am not able to travel like I use too, shooting here in Oklahoma, Mississippi and Texas, there is some but, not a lot of compensating to do....
David,
That is an interesting account and just adds more fun to long range shooting by having people think about bullet ballistics. Wind, spin drift, pressure, etc make long range shooting a thinking game more akin to chess. I really enjoy this aspect the most. This seems to be an attractant like bow hunters have with needing to get scent free and much more sneaky.
The SAKO is an old TRG-S, the M995 version. It is originally chambered in 338L, but it a sporter type rifle. The action is soooo smooth and super strong. The Shilen barrel is ready. Thinking about one of the new Nightforce MOAR reticle scopes.
great topic.
That is an interesting account and just adds more fun to long range shooting by having people think about bullet ballistics. Wind, spin drift, pressure, etc make long range shooting a thinking game more akin to chess. I really enjoy this aspect the most. This seems to be an attractant like bow hunters have with needing to get scent free and much more sneaky.
The SAKO is an old TRG-S, the M995 version. It is originally chambered in 338L, but it a sporter type rifle. The action is soooo smooth and super strong. The Shilen barrel is ready. Thinking about one of the new Nightforce MOAR reticle scopes.
great topic.
Fluxed,
are you going to go with the 8X-32x magnification?
I have been drooling over the Night Force 12X-42X Benchrest scope with the NP-R2 reticle but, I don't see one in my foreseeable future...
What barrel length and contour are you going with?
One thing I always thought was funny, was when Remington came out with their Sendero model and 26" barrels. Everybody thought they were able to shoot deer over into the next county. And you always heard guys at the local sporting goods store talk about the deer they killed at 500 yds. or the far side of 800 yds. etc. and you politely ask them how they know it was that far. Then you ask them what gun, scope and load they were using. Things start smelling fishy right off the bat but, you play nice and let them talk. Okay, so you shot this deer at 500 yds.? What kind of rest did you have? How is your scope set? How many clicks did it take for you to dial your scope in or did you just hold over the top of the deers back??? It's really hard to not laugh in some of these guys face but, out of respect, you just keep quiet...
Over a 1 year time period, I had invited enough of these guys to my shooting range, that I was able to purchase all the components to build myself a full custom rifle - action, barrel, stock, trigger, scope and everything else. The deal was, that you took your rifle, with three shots, and had to hit an IHMSA silhouette ram - a 70 lb. steel target at 600 yds.. If you hit the target one time out if three, I would give then a hundred $$$ bill. If they could not hit "Rambo" in three shots, they owed me a hundred bucks. Not a single one of these guys ever touched Rambo and I made a lot of money off that slab of steel...
Problem 1- These guys had no earthly idea what 600 yds. was...
Problem 2- They never shot that far before no time in their lives...
Problem 3- The crosshairs in their scope completely blocked out the target...
Problem 4- They did not know how to dope the wind...
Problem 5- Plain abd simple, none of these guys knew HOW to shoot! Poor technique, poor rifle handling qualities, poor marksmanship, etc.. These guys and guys like them is what gives long range shooting a bad name...
And for the record, I did shoot Rambo for these guys, after they wasted their time, ammo and money and said I had to shoot the target and I only got one shot! Bang........ting...pay up....
are you going to go with the 8X-32x magnification?
I have been drooling over the Night Force 12X-42X Benchrest scope with the NP-R2 reticle but, I don't see one in my foreseeable future...
What barrel length and contour are you going with?
One thing I always thought was funny, was when Remington came out with their Sendero model and 26" barrels. Everybody thought they were able to shoot deer over into the next county. And you always heard guys at the local sporting goods store talk about the deer they killed at 500 yds. or the far side of 800 yds. etc. and you politely ask them how they know it was that far. Then you ask them what gun, scope and load they were using. Things start smelling fishy right off the bat but, you play nice and let them talk. Okay, so you shot this deer at 500 yds.? What kind of rest did you have? How is your scope set? How many clicks did it take for you to dial your scope in or did you just hold over the top of the deers back??? It's really hard to not laugh in some of these guys face but, out of respect, you just keep quiet...
Over a 1 year time period, I had invited enough of these guys to my shooting range, that I was able to purchase all the components to build myself a full custom rifle - action, barrel, stock, trigger, scope and everything else. The deal was, that you took your rifle, with three shots, and had to hit an IHMSA silhouette ram - a 70 lb. steel target at 600 yds.. If you hit the target one time out if three, I would give then a hundred $$$ bill. If they could not hit "Rambo" in three shots, they owed me a hundred bucks. Not a single one of these guys ever touched Rambo and I made a lot of money off that slab of steel...
Problem 1- These guys had no earthly idea what 600 yds. was...
Problem 2- They never shot that far before no time in their lives...
Problem 3- The crosshairs in their scope completely blocked out the target...
Problem 4- They did not know how to dope the wind...
Problem 5- Plain abd simple, none of these guys knew HOW to shoot! Poor technique, poor rifle handling qualities, poor marksmanship, etc.. These guys and guys like them is what gives long range shooting a bad name...
And for the record, I did shoot Rambo for these guys, after they wasted their time, ammo and money and said I had to shoot the target and I only got one shot! Bang........ting...pay up....
Well sounds like I'm your huckleberry.
I'll give you 30 days to name place and time anywhere in Oklahoma. I will cover my travelling expenses.
We'll setup a target at 400 yards and run a vertical strip of electrical tape.
$500 says you won't hit it 5 times in the row. No sighters, no bullsh!t.
5 shots - 5 hits - and the money is yours: no hard feelings, I'll call it a cheap tuition to long range shooting.
You make one miss I take the money and an apology for calling me a jackass: no hard feelings I hope.
If $500 is not "worth your time" - we can bump it to $1000 for 10 shots.
P.S. So how do you get a shelf full of badges, awards, plaques, ribbons, etc... without ever competing?
x2 on the M995, I've got the same in a .30-378. Trying to decide on putting a longer tube on the .30-378 or switching over to a .338 cartridge of some type.
I guess I'd have to say that, at least for me, no wind can mean up to a 2-3 mph wind. I don't start adding clicks to my scope until wind speed reaches 5 mph. This also depends on the "target". If I am shooting a deer or a coyote, and my wind flags are moving, I do in fact dial-in to correct for windage. Steel targets, paper targets, water jugs or whatever, I don't bother dialing-in, for low winds that is. That's where knowledge and experience and literally thousands and thousands of rounds of practice come in to play. I have done so much of this instinctively over the years that, I really don't have to think about it, I just do it. Also, for guys just getting into long range shooting, when you are shooting at the extended ranges into the wind, you also have to make extra corrections for elevation as well. It all comes down to practice, practice, more practice and then more and more. Shoot in differeñt wind speeds, angles, uphill and downhill. I could write thousands of pages on shooting at long and extreme ranges but, if your not willing to put in the trigger time, none of it would make a nickels worth of difference....
On the deer I shot at a total distance of 3 ft. 6 in., I shot that deer with a 7 1/2" barreled stainless Ruger Super Blackhawk with factory sights. My load was shooting Sierra's 180 gr. JHP bullets...
Location was Kokomo, Mississippi...
I was hunting a section of flooded timber bottom, loaded with red oak and white oak trees. There was one dead tree that I found that was very massive in size, in the middle of all these other healthy trees. This dead tree was hollow in the middle with a 2 1/2 to 3 ft. opening on one side...
I got into the woods early one morning before daylight, and crawled up in this hollow tree. It was COLD out, so no fear of snakes but, I had several coons, possums and squirrel that tried to run me out before the day was over...
Anyways, I'm sitting inside this hollowed out tree for about 6 hours, when I hear acorns crunching. Then something starts us against the tree. I had an idea of what it was but, not 100% sure. I went ahead and slipped my ear muffs on, eased the hammer back on my pistol and waited. Acorns still crunching like nobody's business. THEN - I see horns come around by the opening in the tree where I am setting. No exaggeration, I could have literally tapped that deer on the head with my pistol barrel. I had on dark gray coveralls and a face mask and the only way that deer would have known I was there was to either smell me or come and crawl in that hollowed out tree with me...
When the deers head came in full view, he was still crunching on a mouthful of acorns and his chin whiskers had small water droplets on them. I have never been that close to a deer in the wild. Well, I finally gained composure after staring face to face and I shot him. Like I said in an earlier post, he was close enough that blood splattered on me at the shot and when the deer dropped, I had to use my feet to move him out of the way, so I could climb out of the tree...
Memories like those are what makes hunting what it is and something that will stay with you for the rest of your life...
Thank you for asking me to tell this. It has been over 15 years since I told it to anyone. Good memories....
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