What additional gun control is coming this week?

[Aries]

Okay, that's good news if it holds up. This was interesting, in the article....

"The president has been in regular contact with Democratic Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia, Republican Pat Toomey of Pennsylvania and Democrat Chris Murphy of Connecticut for several weeks on a bill that would require background checks on commercial gun sales, including at gun shows and online."

Am I missing something in the terminology of "commercial gun sales" or something? What in that statement is not already law??

 

[TwoForFlinching]

Is the "universal background check" meant to require a 4473 for private transactions?

 

[dennishoddy]

Is the "universal background check" meant to require a 4473 for private transactions?

Yes, that is the intent. You cannot transfer a firearm to your son, daughter, mother or father without doing a 4473. Every transaction would be required to file that form and undergo a NICS check.
I went into this the other day. There are already over 43 million firearms that have already been sold and resold without 4473's among private parties. Why not just continue them in a black market like criminals and felons already do?
How is the universal background checks going to stop anything? The government and LEO agencies don't prosecute felons and drug abusers that lie on 4473's now. If I remember right there were three people prosecuted last year in the entire US? Don't hold me to that number but that number came across in a political discussion I saw on TV.
For the record, universal background checks, nor the current background checks would have prevented a single mass school shooting. All were legal owners purchased through the current system.

 

[TwoForFlinching]

All were legal owners purchased through the current system.

I thought the Odessa-Midland shooter failed his 4473 and picked up a second hand AR private party. At least, that's what I read. Whether or not it's accurate is something the gov probaboy won't admit.

Purely devils advocate, but what if universal only applied to sales? As if you could gift a firearm in the complete absence of compensation, cash and trade. Then you'd be free to hand down firearms through your lineage. Sure, there would be those that cheat the system, but it'd be no different than the questionable 'non-dealers' that seem to eek out a small profitable market in private sales and transfer. Not that the many should pay for the few, but would a familial included exception be a better argument than asking for the same rights as criminals?

Don't get me wrong, laws don't prevent crime... I'm just prepping for the inevitable debate.

I had the PD come knocking on my office door once because a gun I sold on Armslist came up used in a crime. I wasn't even the 4473 OG buyer. Just another dude in the loop... but they guy I sold it to ended up banging in another neighborhood. They were cool about it, and I sat there quietly, biting my tongue as they lectured me. Didn't use armslist for a long time after that.

 

[dennishoddy]

I thought the Odessa-Midland shooter failed his 4473 and picked up a second hand AR private party. At least, that's what I read. Whether or not it's accurate is something the gov probaboy won't admit.

Purely devils advocate, but what if universal only applied to sales? As if you could gift a firearm in the complete absence of compensation, cash and trade. Then you'd be free to hand down firearms through your lineage. Sure, there would be those that cheat the system, but it'd be no different than the questionable 'non-dealers' that seem to eek out a small profitable market in private sales and transfer. Not that the many should pay for the few, but would a familial included exception be a better argument than asking for the same rights as criminals?

Don't get me wrong, laws don't prevent crime... I'm just prepping for the inevitable debate.

I had the PD come knocking on my office door once because a gun I sold on Armslist came up used in a crime. I wasn't even the 4473 OG buyer. Just another dude in the loop... but they guy I sold it to ended up banging in another neighborhood. They were cool about it, and I sat there quietly, biting my tongue as they lectured me. Didn't use armslist for a long time after that.

Your correct on the Odessa shooter. My mistake, but the background check worked right? He got one on the black market which is what criminals do. Was it a stolen firearm? I haven't heard.
If the Universal only applied to sales, there would have to be a check or money order to offer proof of sale, otherwise a cash deal would go under the radar being called a "gift".

 

[TwoForFlinching]

Your correct on the Odessa shooter. My mistake, but the background check worked right? He got one on the black market which is what criminals do. Was it a stolen firearm? I haven't heard.
If the Universal only applied to sales, there would have to be a check or money order to offer proof of sale, otherwise a cash deal would go under the radar being called a "gift".

They haven't said whether it was a gray area private sale, such as armslist, or procured through black market shenanigans. But would that argument around UBC's be that they won't stop black market availability? So there's no use in punishing lawful citizens?

 

[dennishoddy]

They haven't said whether it was a gray area private sale, such as armslist, or procured through black market shenanigans. But would that argument around UBC's be that they won't stop black market availability? So there's no use in punishing lawful citizens?

I suspect it was a black market sale or else the libatards would be all over the sale on armslist or OSA to justify their narrative. It's never been mentioned in the news where he obtained the weapon that I'm aware of. Someone else may have heard?
There is absolutely no reason to punish lawful citizens but the objective of the left is to disarm us so they can control us no matter how many baby steps it takes. The Republicans are spineless and will allow it to happen because they also clueless. There isn't a single libertarian candidate out there that will fight it either.

 

[TwoForFlinching]

There is absolutely no reason to punish lawful citizens

I whole heartedly agree. Wish you'd spread that truth for some of our more liberal members over in the vaping thread.

 

[farmerbyron]

Okay, that's good news if it holds up. This was interesting, in the article....

"The president has been in regular contact with Democratic Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia, Republican Pat Toomey of Pennsylvania and Democrat Chris Murphy of Connecticut for several weeks on a bill that would require background checks on commercial gun sales, including at gun shows and online."

Am I missing something in the terminology of "commercial gun sales" or something? What in that statement is not already law??

These morons making laws don’t even know the current law. That’s what that means.

 

[rlongnt]

They haven't said whether it was a gray area private sale, such as armslist, or procured through black market shenanigans. But would that argument around UBC's be that they won't stop black market availability? So there's no use in punishing lawful citizens?

Whoa... Grey area. There is nothing grey about it. It's legal. Suggesting that it's grey only fuels the opposition.